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Tree swallows on the bluebird trail (Part 1)Also see Dead Tree Swallows in Nestbox and Violet Green Swallows Subj: Re: Belated answer Date: 5/25/99 10:04:25 PM Central Daylight Time From: scriv001"at"tc.umn.edu (Dorene Scriven) Liz Cole writing from nw PA I'm sorry to hear your material was taken for the Bluebirds! book that I recommended. I guess it's a form of flattery that I enjoyed your work so much, but I'm sure that's no consolation to you. Please tell about your book. Is it still available? While I'm writing, I have a Swallow question for all. One of the nest boxes in our yard was claimed by TRSWs during 2 consecutive years (we've been here and had boxes up for 5 years) Each year the female was killed by HOSPs while brooding her eggs, her eyes pecked out and left for dead in the box. TRSWs stopped coming around. This year they were back for 2 weeks but have moved on. What I've noticed is that Barn Swallows fill the void whenever the TRSWs vacate the area. The two species are never seen on our 5 acres at the same time. Is this coincidence or a territorial 'rule' between the species? Dear Liz Cole. Please forgive the delay in answering your earlier Message. Finally got our book to the printer last Thursday. It should be off the presses after the first week in June. This will be the third edition, and has quite a few updates, plus some coverage on western and mountain bluebirds. AT this point I am not sure about the price, but imagine it will be a couple of dollars more than the 2nd edition of 1993, i.e., probably about $14 postpaid. Re: your tree swallow question. As far as I know, there may be feeding areas which overlap with the barn swallows, but not nesting territories. I don't know why they are not there the same year, unless there just isn't enough food (flying insects) for both. Sorry to hear about the sparrows killing the tree swallows. One trick that Bob Orthwein of Ohio has tried is triple boxing, i.e., 3 boxes, all the same, about 15-20 feet apart. The bluebirds take one, the later tree swallows the second box, and the house sparrows may well accept the third box, at which place they can be trapped. You don't indicate if your boxes were paired. We think that is a big advantage, whether just two boxes paired, or three as Bob Orthwein has done. Normally the tree swallows are very good at keeping the house sparrows away, but if there are not enough boxes available, the house sparrow is more apt to kill the bluebirds or tree swallows in one of the boxes. Have you had bluebirds in your boxes as well? Dorene Scriven Subj: TRES puzzler Subj: Re: TRES
puzzler Subj: Re: TRES puzzler Subj: TRES Subj: Re: TRES
puzzler Subj: Tree
Swallow numbers Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 15:33:27 -0800 First, congratulations to Betty for the first bluebird egg of Y2K! All I've got is mostly dozens of boxes with claim straws/party ribbons.Which brings me to a question I have for the tree swallow people: During the past few weeks, I had the typical bluebird claim straws in a nestbox. Today, the box has those claim straws but they have been pushed away from the center to the floor edges. Now on center stage inthe middle of the box floor is a single pure white cupped-shaped feather(about 2" oval) and I'm wondering if this is typical of tree swallow staking over a nestbox from bluebirds. I've never had a tree swallow nesting my boxes. In addition, I've never had claim straws replaced by alarge white cupped feather in the center of an otherwise empty nestbox .Elizabeth Nichols wrote: THIS IS TO ANNOUNCE THE FIRST EASTERN BB EGG WAS LAID 2-19-2000 in Frederick County, MD at the Middletown County Park, Middletown, MD!!!!!!!! Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 20:27:05 EST Linda, Yes, TRSW do compete with the bluebirds. But do not worry, they are NOTHING like the darn HOSP and the HOWR. but I have had a male EABL lay claim to a box and well, they kicked him out! If you place two nestboxes about 10ft. apart, the BBs will take one box and tree swallows the other. The swallows will defend both boxes from others of their species. I have had lots of TRSW nest in my boxes so I am telling you from experience and from what I read. I know you will enjoy being their landlord cause I sure do. They are very sweet birds. Good Luck! Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 19:58:02 EST Hi all... Just a report from Putnam County, New York...6o miles north of NYC....and from Newtown, CT....75 miles north east of NYC....At school the bluebirds are checking out the boxes. We've been putting out Linda Janilla's recipe which we made the other day. My class and a second grade class went out today and cleaned out all the boxes. I actually thought they had been cleaned by another teacher over the summer, but they were a mess. There was one flattened BB nest with a sterile egg, a housewren dummy nest, and a dead tree swallow baby in a used tree swallow nest. This year I will take care of the final cleaning. However, the tree swallow situation leads me to a question. How many of you monitor your tree swallow boxes? Because I don't keep such close tabs on them, I'm always afraid to open the boxes never sure when the babies are due to fledge. Any input on this? As for my home............ for the past two days I've seen a male on top of my Peterson box. This morning as I was dashing to work...out of control late...I saw him perched on my mealie feeder. I felt guilty, but had to leave. As soon as I got home, though, I rescued some mealworms from my basement..and whistled..AND....there they were in a flash. Must be the parents from last year. Neither gave a moment's hesitation about coming. Then I remembered the full heart and big smile their gentle presence brings! I've ordered my usual 5000 worms and am having them delivered to school. I used a phone in my classroom to order. My third graders could not stop giggling at my conversation. " Hi, I'd like to order 5000 medium mealworms." I heard them laughing as they went off to lunch shaking their heads at the novelty of a teacher who pops on the phone to order such an oddity. I love watching their first reaction to the wiggling little guys. We spent the morning reading A Bluebird's First Summer..and looking at pictures of bluebirds, house sparrows, etc. Spring is really, really here! Take care all of you whose hearts must be singing like mine! Nancy Bocian Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 17:54:43 -0600 Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas Magpies can learn to land on the roof of the house and look into the entrance hole. The young birds thinking the parents are there to feed them will fight to get to the entrance hole to be fed, only to be pulled through the entrance hole and become food instead! Myrna Pearman in Alberta has witnessed this happening all along their trails in the past. Once a predator learns to feed at a nestbox they are very hard to stop and also others will learn by watching the successful predators. I have always questioned the use of shallow boxes and why so many bluebirders cut grooves to make it easy for the bluebirds to climb within reach of a predator! I have had baby bluebirds fledge from PVC nestboxes which were 9" deep from top of nest to bottom of entrance hole. Since prematurely fledged birds are less capable of flying would it not be better to have boxes that might keep the young in the box even one more day? Even tree swallows have fledged from deep smooth fronted boxes along some northern trails. Where swallows are not a local nester consider leaving the inside front smooth thus forcing the young to be strong enough to hop up to the entrance hole! ... Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 21:07:56 -0600 Bill Darnell, Savannah, TN I am glad you posted this, Keith. I could never reason why fledgling BB's or any other bird except wood ducks would need help to get to the exit. At that stage, they can easily fly/hop to the hole. I also wonder if the two-holer would help in predations like the Magpie described below? I don't suppose it would make a difference. Bill ... Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 22:14:50 EDT Rhonda Watts Keith's question re. inside of the box smooth vs. grooved is one that has occurred to me. My boxes all come with smooth interior--I'm not up to making my own, nor modifying them. I've had eastern BBs, chickadees, tree swallows, and tufted titmice all seem to find a way out with the smooth front. Who grooves the natural cavities? Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 09:13:09 -0500 Hi Gary and all - I have had two unhappy experiences with tree swallows unable to fledge, and highly recommend the roughened inside for them. The first time, we didn't know till we looked in the box and found 5 dead ones, having seen 2 babies come out before we left. The second time we carefully watched after two fledged, but no more. Parents tended to the fledged babies and never went back to the box-they must be programmed" to expect all to fledge together. We went to the box after 1/2 hour and pushed remaining babies through the hole - didn't want to do this but also didn't want to see them die like the previous ones. Parents then tended all young up on the wires. All our other bird species come back for a last check, and often fledging is spread over two days with parents continuing to feed, but tree swallows do not do this, at least not here. We have had no more trouble after gouging the inside box front. I think the first fledglings climb up over the others, and those on the bottom are stuck. My boxes are wood, so I suspect PVC would cause even more problems. Dot (upstate NY north of Syracuse) ... Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 07:21:34 -0800 From Wendy Guglieri in Rescue, Ca. Regarding the following post: Rhonda Watts Keith's question re. inside of the box smooth vs. grooved is one that has occurred to me. My boxes all come with smooth interior--I'm not up to making my own, nor modifying them. I've had eastern BBs, chickadees, tree swallows, and tufted titmice all seem to find a way out with the smooth front. Who grooves the natural cavities? Rhonda et al: All of the boxes that I've ever dealt with in trails around my neck of the woods (and I've seen a lot of boxes) have unfinished (rough) wood on the inside of the box. This is enough of a toe-hold for the Swallows. The are the ones, I believe, who cannot climb up a smooth-finished board. I've been led to believe from a multitude of posts on this List that it is essential for the fledging and ultimate survival of the Swallows. Have noticed only a couple of boxes that were grooved. I know nothing about working with wood, but surely there is some fairly easy way to "scarify" the interior wood of the box. Any suggestions? Wendy Guglieri Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 10:41:23 -0500 I wonder if this is what happened to my tree swallows. I had two nests of swallows last year that the soon to be fledlings were doing fine and then I found them just dead on the nest. No evidence of damage to their bodies. Although my boxes have ventilation, I, at that time, could only think that it might have been the extreme heat of summer. I will have to check those two specific boxes to see if they have grooves. All of my boxes are somewhat different due to acquiring them year after year. Kim in Broad Run Maryland... Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 07:41:51 -0800 Nancy and everyone else: Why don't you monitor the Swallows? Do you also not monitor other species? I
guess I assumed that everyone monitored their NESTBOXES, which would include any
species nesting in them. That's certainly how I've been taught. We collect data
on ALL species utilizing the "Bluebird" nestboxes. Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 07:50:33 PST Sure. Open the door and lay it flat on a workbench so as not to destroy the hinge nail alignments....and then on the inside of the door....below the entrance hole/slot.....take a large cold chisel and ramdomly "ding" the surface in that area making small pits in the door surface. The same thing can be done with a Wonder Bar or with a large Phillips head screwdriver or with the handle end of a file or an ice pick/awl...almost anything that will roughen up the inside of the door. Saw kerfs are nice but they must be done BEFORE the box is assembled unless you're willing to to take the door off and then re-mount it. This will work...I've done it hundreds of times. Dean Sheldon, Huron County, OH [one county south of Lake Erie] ... Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:25:58 EST Wendy (and the group, I monitor ALL of the birds that use my nestboxes!!! To me, the western bluebird is just the "poster child" for all of the secondary cavity nesters. 90% of my (80+)nestboxes are used by tree swallows and western bluebirds (fairly evenly split); the other 5% are used by oak titmouse, ash-throated flycatcher, white-breasted nuthatch, and house wren. I am much more thrilled by the presence of an ash-throated or a titmouse than I am by a western bluebird...mainly because these are birds that are becoming much rarer due to habitat destruction. As far as tree swallows go...remember that these birds have flown quite a distance to return to your nestbox to raise their young! Dee Warenycia (warbler5"at"aol.com) Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 12:56:28 -0500 ...It is fun to monitor Tree Swallows(TRES)! While completing nest-building the TRES will snatch a light-colored feather from your hand. The feathers act as insulation for nestlings. Also, early in the year I have removed dead TRES from box where he perished. Following their long migration they are obviously low on energy and probably have difficulty exiting smooth box. For this reason I make certain inside front of box is roughed up. Natural cavities already are rough enough for their NATURALLY weak legs to grasp for exit. We need the presence of TRES due to their protective habits against the House Sparrows. They are a delight! Betty Nichols, Middletown, MD Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 13:40:37 -0500 (EST) Joe Huber Venice Fl. The city on the gulf. Hello all, At one tie all my boxes had saw kerfs cut below the entrance hole. Later it was found that the built in sparrow trap that was used in all my boxes made a good toe hold for the nesting birds. The rod that crosses the front just below the entrance hole is in the ideal position for birds to grab to get out. From experience at watching the adults feed the young this same rod helps them reach in to feed and to remove waste sacks. Have seen adult birds go in so far that only the tip of their tail is sticking out, and then back out with ease. IT is evident that they are using the rod to hold onto. Tree SWallows found dead in a nest box is a problem that we all have had since the beginning of the bluebird trails across the country. Many adult Tree Swallows have been found dead in the box before the nest is built. Are we sure it is a slick box front that is the problem? This seems to be every ones guess and has been for years. This is the only thing we can do any thing about. Now is the time to make any changes if needed before the swallows start nesting. Joe... Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 14:09:20 -0600 I first should state, that I have never had any experience with Tree Swallows. However, I have enjoyed Barn Swallows and Purple Martins most of my life. One year, in Western Missouri and Eastern Kansas, there was an absolutely amazing infestation of Army Worms that were devastating crops. To protect the crops, many farmers hired crop dusters to spray their infested fields. The result was horrific on its toll of Purple Martins and Barn Swallows, both of which take their prey on the wing. I can't help but wonder if the Tree Swallow is also exposed to similar pesticide dangers, more so than ground feeding birds, resulting in finding so many dead mature adults in nestboxes? It is strange that there are two insect eating species in the same area and one specie (particularly the mature adult) is found dead in nestboxes, while the other remains relatively unscathed. Is anyone familiar with a study that addresses this question? Fread J. Loane Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 01:38:23 -0800 My nestboxes fledge equal amounts of BB's and Tree Swallows. The swallows are every bit as good as the BB's in parenting their young. Simply monitor all our nestboxes in the same way and frequency.In some areas the swallows are declining in numbers, whereas BB's are holding their own.Our efforts may help declining species. David Cook Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 19:46:23 EDT Rhonda Watts, Sorry, all, I should have clarified "smooth". My boxes are rough (unplaned) wood. Date: Thu, 9 Mar 2000 20:07:24 EST BB'ers The first year I had a BB trail my nest boxes had no toe holds on the inside of the front. I found eight dead VGSW &TRSW that year and thought that pesticides must be killing them. When I asked fellow BB people about my findings they informed me that the swallows do not have as strong of feet as the BB, They catch there food on the wing not by hawking like the BB. Also that when the swallows return in the spring many are weekend from there migration, look for shelter in our boxes and are to week to climb out without toe holds. All my new boxes have grooves cut in the front and the old ones have a square of wire mesh stapled under the entrance hole. I have never found another dead swallow in one of my boxes again! As for the natural nest cavities It should be obvious, only man uses a planer to smooth his wood projects, the very act of excavating a hole in a tree with your beak will make the sides ruff enough to make toe holds. Sam Pointer Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 20:46:11 EST OK. On this particular subject on grooves or no grooves. I have a suggestion......PUT THEM ON!! It won't hurt anything (including you) It doesn't take only but a minute more to include them on your box. Kevin Bloom Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 18:32:38 -0500 Hi all - this is especially for beginners who may not be aware of the fun of giving feathers to tree swallows (TRES). Now is a good time to collect clean soft white feathers about 1-3 inches long. Wait until the nest is being built, go out about 20 feet from their box where they can see you, and float a feather in their direction. Both male and female will chase after it and take it to the nest. Often one will drop the feather in air for the other to catch, and play that game for a few minutes. If feathers are in short supply in your area, TRES will take yours right from your hand after a while. It's a great way to get a close-up look at these birds. I stand on my porch roof sometimes, which makes it easier to float the feathers. Once the eggs are laid, they are no longer interested. I recall a study not quite completed that indicated that nests with lots of feathers may result in healthier babies. A good place to find feathers is anywhere sea gulls hang out. Try it if you like these birds! Dot Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 18:52:33 -0500 Dot and others, I collect used feathers from Tree Swallow nests after fledging, wash them and
let them dry, and re-use them again the next year! Dot is right, it's great fun
to watch! Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 09:30:38 -0500 Hi all - I have had a number of replies about collecting feathers, so thought I had better add a note of warning. Please don't buy feathers at a craft store - heaven knows what chemical preservatives have been used that might cause harm to young birds lying next to them. Also please don't take groups of people near any swallow box and risk causing birds to desert the nest. Throwing of feathers is for one or two people only, preferably ones who are already familiar to the birds at that box. Dot Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 15:50:41 -0500 Hi Everyone, It is so exciting hearing about all the bluebird activity from all over the country. You guys in the south with your nests and eggs (I'm a little envious) and those way up north who spotted a bluebird for the first time this year. I love reading it all! My question: I purchased a new nestbox today which had a NABS approved label on the front. It was made by a company in PA. It was certainly a traditional NABS style and materials (unpainted pine wood, overhang, proper entrance hole--I had them measure it, etc.) I also purchased 3/4 inch pipe so I can get it up ASAP at my daughter's house. After I got home, I looked inside the box and found a piece of nylon screen stapled to the front of the box, directly under the entrance hole. With all the recent discussion about smooth versus rough wood below the entrance hole, I wonder whether this is a new strategy to address the problem that's been discussed about birds getting out of the box. Any thoughts? Anyone else see a box like this. Patty in WV ... Date: Sun, 9 Apr 2000 00:25:21 EDT Date: Sun, 09 Apr 2000 06:51:28 EDT Date: Sun, 09 Apr 2000 07:52:38 -0400 Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 08:29:53 -0500 ... Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 11:56:37 -0400 Hi, Gang! Checked some of my nestboxes today. Found the beginning of a
bluebird nest at one location, and a pair defending another box down the road.
Tree Swallows (TRES) are flying all over the place! One box, however, had a dead
pair of TRES inside. One was an unbanded SY female. The other was a male, band
#217130120, which I immediately recognized as one of mine from last year. Upon
checking when I got home, this male was banded on 6/16/99 at the same box where
I found him today. Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2000 12:15:03 EDT Yes!!! Add me to the list. What to do with hoards of tree swallows. The bluebirds don't stand a chance; the TRES are taking over the houses and even the air too! Jerry Houser Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 00:20:58 -0400 ... About where Tree swallows go in the cold. Unlike the BBs, the swallow must find its food on the wing. When it gets cold, and no apparent insects are flying, they head for the streams and lakes. Here they find the hatching of insects such as stone flies etc. Its really their only hope for survival. Most years in the north, the early arriving vanguards suffer large casualties, and this year is one of the worst i have seen in years! I would be interested to hear from other New Englanders on how their Tree swallows faired for them this spring. Please post what you find.......... I expect to find many dead swallows in my boxes this weekend here in 1000' high NW CT.....Just north of me in Goshen and Norfolk, they had all white ground yesterday in the cold, snowy day we had! .....Paul from cold CT Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 07:42:44 EDT Paul, I appreciate your posting about where tree swallows go in the cold weather. I had been wondering. Although they were flying around school two weeks ago. I have seen no sign of them in the boxes or out since we returned. Nancy Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 07:08:12 -0500 ... Since purple martins are swallows also, most might find this interesting. There were some articles on the purple martin forum about feeding the martins at the PMCA headquarters in Edinboro, PA. They were tossing crickets in the air and the lethargic martins at first only showed a little interest, but when one finally swooped down and caught one, the whole colony got into the act. Forgot how many crickets they ate, but it was a lot. Also, other northern landlords had been lowering the houses and gourds and putting crickets which had their heads crunched a little so they would not crawl away, and those birds were devouring them. This might work in the tree swallow nest boxes. Just thought it was
interesting. Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:27:54 EDT Hi Paul and others, Thanks for posting about the TRES in the cold. I am in NY just over the
border from SE Connecticut and about two weeks ago ( when it was a little Jane Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 08:34:00 -0400 Hi Paul and all, Here in the Lake Ontario snowbelt north of Syracuse, NY, the tree swallows are also in trouble. After a spell of warm weather a while back, our daily high temperatures have barely gotten to 40 in the last 3 weeks. The snow flurries we're getting off and on don't help. I have seen NO tree swallows at all yet in their usual places. A few years back, we had similar weather, and many, many TRES died from lack of flying insects. Their population still hasn't recovered here. In recent years, instead of lots of pairs fighting for nestboxes, I am lucky to get even two. Last year I had one pair (they were successful); the year before I had none. Yes, it would be nice if Mother Nature stopped her cruel tricks! Dot.. Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:08:15 EDT Sherry Hunter This morning I saw my first tree swallow ever. He was sitting on the farm field fence post. He flew toward the bluebird nestbox but the male bluebird got there first and sat on top so the swallow flew on. The tree swallow must have been attracted to my yard my the nestbox. He is a beautiful bird, white white breast and a blue/green head. I remember reading on this list, BLuebird - L, that pairing boxes for bluebirds and swallows is good and can keep house sparrows away as the tree swallows will protect both boxes. Should I now put up a second nestbox or would it disturb my bluebirds now who have just started laying eggs? If I should how far apart should the boxes be? I have not had any problems with the few house sparrows around here so far . Would putting up another box attract the house sparrows and cause problems? Thank you in advance for your help on this. Date: Wed, 3 May 2000 14:31:15 -0500 Last year, for the first time I had tree swallows move into one of our nestboxes. This year they have reappeared and unceremoniously tossed out the chickadee eggs that were already in the box. According to the Audubon Society man who leads bird walks at the Arboretum, tree swallows don't nest in this part of the world--they just migrate through. However, I have been able to show him "the exception that proves the rule" as he said. My question is: last Friday I saw a tree swallow sitting on top of a different nest box (about 1/2 mile from the original tree swallow nest). There were 10-day old bluebird nestlings in this box. When I returned yesterday, the nestlings were dead & putrifying. There were 2 feathers in the box. Are tree swallows typically this aggressive? Am I going to have to start pairing nestboxes where tree swallows are likely to nest? Does anybody know if they are extending their range southward? 2nd Query: I also had a nest yesterday with 3 regular-sized EABL eggs, and
one very small egg of the same color--about 1cm in length. Does anyone know
anything about this phenomenon? Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 13:34:14 -0400 Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 13:43:24 -0400 Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 16:57:19 -0400 Try this for size. In box # 90 had very few pieces
of nesting but their was two dead tree swallows and one live tree swallows was
in the box with Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 18:38:35 -0500 Date: Thu, 4 May 2000 21:07:57 -0400 Claire, et al: - My first Bluebird nest, back in
1991, was harrassed by Tree Swallows until the Bluebirds just gave up and left,
abandoning the eggs. (I only had one box that year.) Then, having harrassed the
Bluebirds clean out of the neighborhood, they never used the nestbox, and the
eggs and nest were still intact when the first snow flew in December. They
seemed to lose interest in the box after the Bluebirds left. (I still have nest
and eggs, intact as ever.) But at no point did the swallows ever touch the Bluebirds, or
their chicks, or their eggs. They just flew around in droves, or perched on the
houses. Since I've been pairing, it's the Bluebirds who are the harrassers and
pesterers, though it's all very mild, friendly, and harmless, - maybe just
curiosity. They're mostly good neighbors. Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 21:44:49 -0700 Hi Robert: Tree Swallows often arrive from their long migration totally exhausted. If they arrive in bad weather with few high flying insects they easily succumb. They take haven in any box they can find. Some will die, some may live. In this weakened condition, it's important that they can climb out of the box; a roughened interior or a ladder under the door may be essential unless you've left an old nest in place which makes the hop to the hole a shorter distance. I've only lost TRES in empty boxes where the floor is about 9 inches below the hole. Hatch Graham... Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 07:37:37 -0500 Hatch Graham stated that he has only lost Tree Swallows in boxes that are 9" deep from entrance to floor. Most of my boxes are 7" deep to help remove the nest a little more from the dangers of the entrance hole predators. I was just curious as to the reason of the depth of Hatch's boxes and predators encountered there. I have always felt that on average deeper boxes save more nesting birds. I limit my boxes to this 7" depth as it is just about as heavy as a 5 year old child can lift and carry. My boxes are normally 4.75"X4.75" square on the bottom. (Largest size box that can be made from the average 1X12" lumber or salvaged 1x6" tongue and groove boards.) If you are only building a box or two consider building these deeper nestboxes! KK Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 12:32:31 -0400 To the Constituency: Maybe this post will be of interest to the whole List. Who knows? Bruce -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Burdett blueburd"at"srnet.com To: Carrie Berry, et al,
Date: Fri, 5 May 2000 13:29:02 -0400 To: One and All: I just received my copy of "Downeast Bluebird', the newsletter of the Bluebird Assn. of Maine. It contains some interesting tables based on their 15-region nestbox survey for 1999. It's too long to type up in its entirety, but I'll give you a condensed idea of what it has to say about Tree Swallow competition, among other things. In Phillips/Dixfield: 119 boxes, 18 used by Bluebirds, 74 used by Tree
Swallows. There is no mention of how many boxes were paired. In Sunapee NH in 1999, I had 52 boxes. 13 were used by Bluebirds, 26 were used by Tree Swallows. You will see that my percentages were noticeably better than the Maine tabulation, and I'd LIKE to attribute my results to pairing. I CAN'T, though, simply because I don't know to what extent the Maine boxes were paired. I'll be trying to find out, but I doubt that they'll be able to tell me. Of course, PART of the low Maine percentages must result from the fact that Maine is farther north than Sunapee NH, and therefore colder. (Yes. There ARE colder places than Sunapee.) If nothing else, I hope these numbers give some of you folks a better idea of how DENSE the Tree Swallow population is in our part of the continent, and how INTENSE the nest-box competition. Bruce Burdett, NHBC, Sunapee NH Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 08:36:29 PDT Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 16:37:50 -0400 Maybe I'll try quickly to get another box up.
(Pairing? I enjoy both species.) I have the box mounted on a grape post, and the
funny thing though , is that about 50 feet away is a Peterson Box in which I
can't keep house sparrows out of. I've removed the nests three times, but they
are persistent in rebuilding it. They don't seem to pay any attention to the
Bluebirds, or Tree swallows, and so far have not molested them. At this point, I
wonder if I should just let nature run it's course? Regards, Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 22:09:32 EDT Date: Sun, 07 May 2000 20:00:18 -0400 ... Hi, Fausto: While most bluebirds are wimps, there are some which are more aggressive. I had a female for a couple of years at one of my boxes which would actually chase the tree swallows in the air. since my trail is at an audubon Sanctuary and location of boxes is not entirely under my control (i.e., no pairing), I have rejoiced to see an aggressive strain of bluebirds being bred. It gives them a chance against the tree swallows! --Jill Miller MMS"at"TheMillers.com,,, Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 07:55:13 -0500 Hello, Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:11:29 -0400 Eunice, et al, Date: Fri, 12 May 2000 21:36:10 -0400 Chickie: - Welcome back. I can't help wondering if you're PAIRING your
houses. Your Tree Swallow problems lead me to suspect that you're not. Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 11:16:43 -0500 Thanks to all who sent a word of advice & encouragement re: my TRES
questions. I respect & appreciate the voice of experience. The saga goes on here
today - I'm home & able to watch the goings on at my boxes. I did put up another
box 12 ft. away from the box the EABL's abandoned (still not sure of who the
culprit was who stole the 3 eggs), and removed the nest with the one egg left in
it - I now call these nestboxes 1A & 1B; TRES were swooping around both boxes
last eve. This morning, however, a pair of EABL's was checking out the boxes!
Another pleasant surprise 2 days ago was that there is a completed EABL nest in
nestbox #3 on our property. I saw the male chase away the dreaded HOSP from it
this morning, that HOSP was also perched on nestbox #2 with the TRES nest in it;
the TRES were not around for some reason. It is only in 40's here & 30 mile an
hour wind today. I never dreamed putting up a few nestboxes would lead to such
drama and excitement; but I am sure learning a lot! Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 06:48:08 EDT Comments, anyone-- I've found pine needles (white pine) in tree swallow nests before, but most of it is usually grass. This year I've got one that's *entirely* pine needles. I thought at first I must have another bluebird, since the pine needles appeared after the blues had already selected a box in the next field, but have not seen any bluebirds there-- only the tree swallows-- since the other box was picked. White feathers and 2 eggs in it today (first TRES of the season!) so it's pretty definite. Rhonda Watts Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 07:12:06 -0400 Rhonda and bluebirders, What I've noticed about Tree Swallow (TRES) nests this year is that they are very skimpy. The grasses are coarse, and the nests are short. Most of them also do not have very many feathers (only 3 or 4 in some that already have eggs). Since central New York has had a very wet spring, the dead, brown grasses they build with are wet. Perhaps this keeps them from building a larger nest? If it's also been wet in your location, do pine needles stay drier than grasses, or dry out faster? As for lack of feathers, I have no explanation. Last year the nests were full
of them. 17 of my boxes are near a wetland, and I know there are geese Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 07:59:20 EDT Rhonda, Brenda and all, The Tree Swallow (TRES) nests I have here in Southern NY all contain some pine needles, one is entirely pine needles underneath the feathers. I thought it was going to be an Eastern Bluebird (EABL) nest ( like you Rhonda ) since these are almost all entirely pine needles here. It looked just like the start of an EABL nest but it turned out to be shallower and then the feathers were added. Just as Brenda says there are not many feathers (maybe around five or six) in the TRES nests and all are pure white. The eggs are real hard to see in amongst these pure white feathers! I don't think they are Goose feathers. I read that TRES use white chicken feathers but these are very large and we don't have chickens that I know of around here. I think they are Swan! I have seen several pairs of Swans on the lakes and ponds.. Is this possible? I can't make any comparison with last year because this is my first! But I
think Brenda's suggestion that grasses have been wet this year is sensible. I have read ( in Scriven and somewhere else ) that nests with pine needles do not usually have blowfly problems so I am happy to have pine needles in most of the nests! Jane Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 14:03:31 -0700 Hi Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 08:28:42 EDT I have three questions about Tree Swallows (TRES) that I hope some of you who've had lots of experience with them can answer. !. Books say that a first year female will often start incubation earlier than the day the last egg is laid. How does that effect the incubation time? Do all the eggs hatch on the same day? Would you count from the day incubation started or the day the last egg is laid? 2.One of the nests at my golf course yesterday had one egg in it that had a House Wren hole in it. The most eggs that there could have been in this nest are three since there were none on Monday. So there could be more to come. I left the egg there for now. Is there a chance that the female will return and lay the rest of her eggs and incubate them - that is if the darned HOWR doesn't attack again? (N.B. This box is not near wooded areas, but there is a clump of trees/shrubs about 50' away. Difficult to aviod at this golf course.) I guess this question would apply to any species as well. 3. Do they use swan's feathers in their nests? This is just out of interest. I'm sure that it's not important to know but the ones in the nests here look like swan and I just wondered. Jane Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 12:43:28 -0400 Jane, et al, I haven't taken enough notes about Tree Swallows to answer your questions about them. I DO know, however, that they'll use all kinds of things to decorate their nests, - feathers of EVERY kind, white birch bark, paper, cloth, - you name it. I've also learned that they do another disconcerting thing: - they simply die, and for no apparent reason. Some say that they simply die of exhaustion, others that they're too weak and spindly-legged to climb out of the box, and therefore starve to death. (I'd be exhausted, too, if I flew around as much as they do.) Fortunately for them and for us, they're in no danger of extermination, - not here anyway. We have them here in DROVES. Bruce Burdett, Grover's Corners, NH... Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 13:45:16 -0700 ... Hi Rhonda and All, I have one with all pine needles, paper and two white feathers. I thought Bluebird or Housesparrow, but it is Tree Swallows. N 43* 04.511 W 83* 36.447 Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 22:00:12 EST While checking my trail this past week I opened one box to find 5 dead nestlings about 13 days old and the female dead on top of them. As I approached the box a tree swallow flew out. I have had a trail of 10 -15 boxes for about 10 years but have had little experience with tree swallows. I have 1 ts nest and is only the 3rd since starting my trail. My question is could the ts have contributed to the death of nestlings and female? The nestlings and female were not bloodied or appear to have been attacked. The owner of the property where the box is located said he had not seen the male for a few days prior. Is it possible the ts could have tormented the female to the point she could not feed the nestlings and they starved? I intend to pair my boxes where ts are competing with the bluebirds. Any input would be appreciated. G. Boone Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 18:38:52 EDT ..Today I saw a female tree swallow who literally played possum or dead on her nest. I opened the nest box. Gently moved the feathers apart. Started to count the eggs. Got to her little body and tried to pick up her flight feathers (by mistake)...She never moved! She had her back to me. I felt certain she was dead, and decided the kids had seen enough death for the day. So I returned to the classroom. I was all prepared to remove her body when I left school today. Instead I saw her cute little face peering out of the nest hole! Have a good night. Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 15:10:58 -0400 Hi Jane and all. Nice to hear from you Jane. I have nests of TREe Swallows (TRES) here at home and on my trail in the park. The TRES nests in the park have white feathers, but those at home are all black feathers!!! Other than the color difference, the nests are alike. Here at home we have a lot of crows and giant tailed grackles. The TRES pick the soft, wide, fluffy, black feathers... just like they do when they pick the white ones. Really neat! Fawzi from M... Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 00:10:34 EDT In a Message dated 5/24/00 10:40:16 AM Eastern Daylight Time, JaneHopeC"at"aol.com writes: Until I have a lot more experience I don't think I will ever decide whose nest is whose until I see the birds or the eggs! Kathy Clark, New Cumberland, PA Amen Jane.. :) Things are always changing.. with competition. I checked a box to find a moss nest with fur.. so of course I think Chickadee.. Well I got back there a week later it has one feather.. Okay.. I write down ? This week I have moss nest with feathers.. and Tree Swallow eggs.. Hee hee.. Last year I had this nest I wanted to rip out in the worst way but resisted.. It was grass and paper towels. heavy on the towels.. I thought it was a HOSP.. but it was a Tree Swallow with no feathers.. Last year we had wren nest.. removed it dummy nest at time.. Then next time we looked we had grass nest..just that of the BB.. but alas. Wren laid her eggs in the bluebird nest.. when we went back. I enjoy these moments.. just like that crooked gourd egg last year.. which didn't hatch.. but the little egg did.. I have been experimenting with hanging boxes this year and it's a little perplexing but I'm enjoying it. I have learned.. or trying to.. what is the best place for them. I had them in good habitats.. I had a bluebird with four eggs and nest built up to top of the box.. in one holer.. huge nest.. Well eggs are now gone.. pecked apart.. but I moved the box around to different side of building. I have a titmouse in one.. and she sat so tight on those eggs. I like this. The rest have sparrows .. I left them at same locations and came back to find same thing. So now I moved them out more from the spots I had them and one was unoccupied.. Perhaps that is success? No sparrow.. I know bluebirds and tree swallows are there in 3 boxes.. one tree swallow got HOSP'D. and closer to where my hanging ones were. I find this extremely interesting and will continue. MIght take me awhile.. and my friend says let them there.. I move them.. Any opinions on that..? I see the male HOSP sitting in the tree when I check. Call it common sense if you will? He's not getting my boxes..no way.. The fun part was learning how to put them up and down.. hee hee.. But I got the hang of it now and the hooks were not right in the beginning.. not standard.. improvised.. Keep on bluebirding!! Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 06:48:53 EDT Same generality in New England; I find lots of ruffed grouse feathers (tan/brown banded). But this year many pure white feathers, and I wish I could figure where they are getting them. No chickens right nearby, more white than the Canada geese could possibly provide... And just to make life really interesting, the TRES seem to be grabbing *anything* including great stiff feathers! I"d love to see a TRES fly carying one of those g Rhonda Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 10:04:19 -0400 Haleya Priest, Amherst MA Decided to move TRES box with eggs this morning - (leap frog method - 10' a day) to get it farther away from tree line since I heard the dreaded HOWR in the woods (box already 150+ ft from woods - but still makes me nervous and know that the eggs are not 100% safe). Anyway, I didn't notice but I moved the box so that it was just BARELY visable to the front yard EABL nestbox. Well, I didn't think it would be an issue anyway for the EABL since they at least FINALLY allowed the TRES to nest in the backyard to start with after not allowing them for quite a while (we're talking boxes 200ft apart, blocked by house and they still had a fit about it, until they finally gave up). Anyway, Thom was downstairs doing yoga and all the sudden hears and sees the male EABL pinning the male TRES to the ground! Talk about freaking out - it was utter chaos out there! The shift was INSTANTANEOUS once we moved the TRES box BACK to it's original location. Everyone settled down immediately! No pairing allowed here at the Priest-Levy residence!!! :-) H Tree swallows on the bluebird trail (Part 2) |
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