Nesting Cavities other than Nestboxes (Part 2)

Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2002 10:26:14 -0400
From: Lisa Bennett lisab"at"superdups.com
Subject: estimate fledglings?

To the great inspiring people on the List,

I have a question and I hope it's not too redundant. I have a situation where I cannot reach a natural cavity where BB's are nesting. With my binoculars I can see 3 baby heads peeking in and out of the nesting entrance. It's in a dead tree way surrounded by a blueberry patch.

Last night at around 7:20 p.m. There was commotion in the woods behind the blueberry patch and I saw one baby hopping up and down on the grass trying desperately to fly- Dad was in the branch above cheering him on. Mom was above them with two other babies. I looked through the binoculars to get a bertter look at the babies and they looked very young , very gray with whitish bellies. When I looked back for the baby on the ground-gone. I don't know if he flew or hopped into the woods. But I looked around the ground for him and nothing.... I hope he made it up to the tree. My question is, if this is normal? Are fledglings usually this clumsy and hop around at first or did the little one fledge prematurely? They were sooooooo cute and precious. Anybody experience bouncing babies before?

Thank you Lisa

Date: Sun, 04 Aug 2002 10:52:14 -0700
From: Linda Violett lviolett"at"earthlink.net
Subject: "Natural" Suburban Site

Linda Violett - Yorba Linda, Calif.

Quite a while ago, someone (Gary Springer?) asked how many of us have witnessed bluebirds nesting in natural cavities and I believe the question was being asked to determine whether bluebirds were losing their instinct/ability to nest in the wild. It was a good question because, even on my forest-edge mountain trail, I've only witnessed bluebirds using natural a cavity once.

Yesterday I discovered nestbox-raised western bluebirds raising chicks in an unlikely urban tree located in a narrow electrical easement between two rows of backyards next to a busy 4-land boulevard. For those who have time and enjoy bluebird adaptability, here's the background:

Last fall/winter, a nestbox was in a dangerous greenbelt area (broken glass, adolescents with BB guns). In an effort to find a safe zone for the birds, I found homeowners on each side of the narrow greenbelt who had big enough trees in their yards to hand a box. A box was hung in both yards to give the birds a choice.

But, the adolescent boy at one "safe" home was given a BB gun for Christmas and I saw him shooting at the trees in the yard so that box, of course, was removed. That left the other box as the only "safe" box. On 3/24, the box had claimstraws and the bluebird pair started fighting car mirrors, pooping on cars, resulting in neighbor complaints. The property lines in our area are only about 60' wide. There wasn't any other large private tree to use so the nestbox had to go BACK into the park where bluebirds had a successful first nesting. (Nestlings in my boxes last year were banded and neither of the pair was banded.)

After the first fledge, I came to the greenbelt and found two females locked in combat on the ground barely moving, only a few wing movements. I should have simply watched but I ran towards them thinking they were inflicting injuries to each other (both were OK). At that point, I sat and watched while a banded male went to the nestbox holes and peek in. One or both of the females also went to the hole but I didn't log down whether she/they were banded.

Second nesting: only an unbanded female has been seen during the entire nesting process; she now has five chicks and I've been bringing her mealworms to help out.

During the past several days, I've been seeing a banded male coming to the single female's area to help himself to mealworms; he flies off toward the old BB-gun house and obviously has babies somewhere, so I've been trying to track him down to a likely homeowner nestbox, without success.

Yesterday I finally found his nest in the fractured top of a ficus tree located in a narrow electrical easement behind the BB-gun house. The tree was poorly cut (whacked off and fractured) to keep it away from the electrical wires and, thus, gave nestbox-raised newlyweds a bare-bones homes in a "natural" site even though it is right in the middle of suburbia, between rows of backyards next to a busy 4-lane boulevard.

This morning I will apply an ant deterrant to the base of the tree and hope for the best.

From: TomGaryH"at"aol.com
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2002 06:50:58 EDT
Subject: Re: "Natural" Suburban Site

Linda, Brenda, Hi

Help me out here. Linda, although not nesting year round, I seem to recall, but am not certain, that your WEBL remain essentially in your trail area throughout the year. If so, on your trail the probability of a banded adult having been born in a nestbox ought to be higher than bluebirds that "migrate," mingle and pair-off with birds (banded and unbanded box and natural borns) from various areas as seems to happen in so very many instances when dealing with EABL.

Linda, Do "your" WEBL remain in your trail area year round?

Brenda, I'll bet "your" EABL's migrate, then mix and match in preparation for a new nesting season. Can you confirm?

Tom Heintzelman Backyard Nestbox Landlord
Milton, Santa Rosa County, FL (western panhandle, inland) U.S.A. ...

From: "Gary Springer" springer"at"alltel.net
Subject: Natural cavities
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 08:32:44 -0400

Gary Springer Carnesville, Georgia April 22, 2003

Yesterday, while driving down the road, I spotted an area recently cleared by loggers. There were about 75 very tall dead standing pines spread out over about 10 acres which the loggers had left behind.. I got out of my truck and took a seat on one of the fallen logs to observe.

Within 10 minutes I spotted a flicker excavating a cavity, a red-bellied woodpecker flying from tree to tree investigating several existing cavities and bluebirds entering and exiting one other which is about 35 feet high.

As there are no tall dead weeds growing on the cleared forest floor, it appears as though this is the first spring since the living pines had been removed to make those dead ones prominent snags and there were already woodpecker holes in about a fourth of the trees.

Most of the woodpecker holes were at least two thirds the way up towards the top of the mostly bleached white branchless telephone pole like trees which put most of these holes at between 30 and 45 feet high or higher. The lowest holes were at about 20 feet and were far less numerous. This seems to be a good indication of nesting height preference because dozens of options were available for woodpeckers from two feet high to 65 feet and many options were available for bluebirds between 25 feet and 45 feet high.

Gary Springer

From: KCBSP"at"aol.com
Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2003 11:07:24 EDT
Subject: Re: Natural cavities

Kathy Clark, New Cumberland, PA
There is a red bellied squawking from his hole off my deck up about the height of a telephone pole. He is sticking or she is I am not sure.. all day long in this manner. They drilled this dead tree up in several spots. I used to see the pileated on it constantly. There is about 13 acres of woods here and it's woodpecker heaven. All day woodpeckers to see. So I have lots of suet. When they bring the young to my porch it's neat to see the parent feed them. They all circle around the poles ( I have a log home). Oh boy they love to peck my house too! I'm trying to cure my carpenter bee dilemma. I have plugged these holes and put powder in them, but these stupid bees keep drilling them out!! I do have less than before, but I learned they return to where they nested the year before!! UGHHH!!! They really do some damage and the woodpeckers are only hungry :) Then we get the carpenter ants!! Anybody who ever thinks of putting a log home in the woods should think again!! ...

From: "Gary Springer" springer"at"alltel.net
Subject: Natural Cacities
Date: Thu, 1 May 2003 21:05:13 -0400

Gary Springer Carnesville, GA May 01, 2003

I've located a site where I can observe active nest cavities of the Red-Headed Woodpecker, the Flicker, the Red-Bellied Woodpecker, and the European Starling, all within a radius of about seventy feet.

The entrances to the Red-Headed Woodpecker and Starling cavities are facing west, the Red-Bellied Woodpecker to the South and the Flicker to the west. All are between about twenty and thirty five feet high.

The cavity occupied by the starling is near the center of the site and there are at least four other pairs of this species, and at least one of these others may have also selected a cavity for a nest.

in addition to the pair of Red-Headed Woodpeckers there is a third which appears to be a female which also appears to be breeding with the male. It spends most of its time alone about 175 yards away. There is a cavity near which it perches quite often but it does not appear to be an active nest cavity.

I have never observed birds nearly as sexually active as these Red-Headed Woodpeckers.

The Starlings are much more bold around the Red-Bellied Woodpeckers and the Flickers than they are around the Red-Headed Woodpeckers which intimidate them..

But, with even the Red-Headed Woodpecker, when they venture away from the cavity, the Starling will investigate the unattended nest cavity. Today a Starling put its head into the Red-Headed Woodpeckers cavity. Within two or three seconds the male Red-Headed Woodpecker flew to the cavity and the Starling departed immediately before the two birds were within about eight feet of each other, and, the female was right behind the male..

The first two times I observed this site the Eastern Bluebird was entering another woodpecker cavity and a Crested Flycatcher was squawking away. But, I spotted neither of these secondary cavity nesting birds today.

Gary Springer.

Date: Wed, 07 May 2003 09:37:07 -0400
From: Pamela Ford jpford"at"comcast.net
Subject: bluebirds nesting in newspaper tube

It seems my backyard bluebirds have been too successful in breeding (if there is such a thing!). As they have produced between 14 and 17 fledglings each year for the past 4 years, the bluebird population in my neighborhood has increased significantly. Earlier this week, they were complained about in the homeowners meeting (unfortunately I wasn't there). It seems there are quite a few trying to nest in the ceramic newspaper tubes below the mailbox in the brick mailbox pillars at the curb. (Fortunately, our newspapers are thrown from a car so the tubes are not used) I've contacted 2 of the 3 parties with specific complaints. One of the nests actually has nestlings in it (I had to reach back in up to my elbow and could feel unfeathered bodies). I've explained the bluebird story and tried to play up what a wonderful event this was, also letting them know that the babies are gone in about 2 weeks. Several neighbors have offered to let me put up boxes in their backyards. (this is not typical bluebird habitat the neighborhood has 90 single family homes arranged in a ring. The outside ring of houses backs onto hay fields, a river, or woods. The inside ring of houses all back onto each other with lot sizes of only BC acre. This inside ring is where the bluebirds are now making their stand!)

So, step one, I'm trying to convert the complaining neighbors into bluebird lovers.

Step two, what about these nestlings in a hole 18 inches deep, 7 inches in diameter, 2 feet above the ground, smack dab on the curb. I was thinking I could tie a fake nestbox front so it was positioned over the large hole, reducing the chance of cat or child predation. Or should I just leave well enough alone?

...Oh, and can't forget my birth announcements 96 my first backyard blues hatched yesterday 96 3 eggs, 3 nestlings)

Pam in Abingdon, Maryland

Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 21:16:07 -0400
Subject: Bluebird takes over phoebe nest!?
From: "Haleya Priest" mablue"at"gis.net

Haleya Priest Amherst MA
Get a load of this!!!! Has anyone ever heard of this:

Hi Haleya, A bluebird family has taken over the nest on top of the light fixture in the carport, where phoebes have lived these past six years.  It is not a cavity at all, except that it is between joists and certainly a discreet location as seen from the ground. Please feel free to come see it! There are young up there, I have heard them screeching for food.

The light fixture is about six inches around, and is attached to the bare two by twelve joist, and faces downward. We hardly ever turn that light on, so the bluebird family isn't receiving any warmth from it. The phoebes added a new nest on top of the old one for several years, so it's now a pile of nesting material about six inches high. The BB parents fly silently away whenever we walk into the carport, unlike the phoebes, used to squalk complainingly whenever they felt they had to leave. :-) Carolyn.

From: "Karen Louise Lippy" brdbrain"at"superpa.net
Subject: Re: Bluebird takes over phoebe nest!?
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 15:51:17 -0400

Some time ago in Sialia (I think it was), there was an article about the many places bluebirds had been found nesting. Phoebe nests were one of the places used as were cliff swallow nests, barn swallow nests, and a few other places that appear to be crazy to us who expect to find them in cavities.

Perhaps the bluebird would have adapted to using these sites as secondary nesters much as they adapted to using abandoned cavities if we hadn't gotten involved in helping them. Karen from South Central PA

From: Lawrence Herbert, lherbert"at"4state.com
Sent: Saturday, November 08, 2003 4:23 AM
Subject: natural cavities

When we lived at Garden City, Finney County, sw Kansas, in the early 80's, there were a lot of EABL's nesting along the Arkansas (pronounced AR Kansas) River. These old Cottonwood snags were created since irrigation in Colorado and sw Kansas had depleted the surface water of the stream and dried them up. I saw several EABL entering old woodpecker holes and a few other cavities. Several of these nesting sites were very high up, 20 or 30 feet. So bluebirds were taking advantage of what was available for nest sites irregardless of height. I had a late May (1985) record for Mountain Bluebird along this same place too.

Good birding, Larry H. Joplin MO. Lawrence Herbert

From: Kerry Sweet [mailto:ksweet3450"at"yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 4:50 PM
Subject: This is a first for me

Hi all- I am so excited ... My daughter has been after me to put a nestbox up at her house because she has been seeing Eastern Bluebirds(EABL) in her yard. Well she is out of town and I have been checking the mail ... She lives by the lake with lots of trees and here is the exciting part ... She has a tree in her yard with a natural cavity and THAT is where the Bluebirds are!! What a sight to see ... I know alot of you have but I have NEVER seen an EABL in a natural cavity before ... so of course I got the camera and I took pictures ... NOW they are nothing like Wendells photos and it is really high up in the tree but you can see the cavity and the male bluebird. I did finally see the female come and go in the hole. I can't wait to tell my daughter... I can hear her now "mother come on its time to go home you can look at the birds tomorrow" :))) If anyone would like to see the pictures I would love to share them. Kerry in NE corner of Okla.

From: Evelyn Cooper [mailto:emcooper"at"bayou.com]
Sent: Sunday, June 13, 2004 7:13 AM
Subject: Bluebirds In Natural Cavity

If you would like to see Kerry Sweet's very nice pictures of the Bluebirds in a natural cavity, go to www.labayoubluebirdsociety.org and click on "Pictures". Thanks, Kerry, that is almost as good as "seeing it for real"! :<) Evelyn Cooper Delhi, LA

From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Monday, June 21, 2004 8:51 AM
Subject: Carolina Wren in natural cavity:-(( Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas

While driving my trail yesterday I saw a Carolina Wren fly from a rotten corner post made from a creosoted power pole. I hit the brakes and backed up to check out the site. Sure enough way down in the hollow post there was a Carolina Wren nest with two eggs!!!!! There was a ball of movement and the just hatched young birds were almost totally consumed by thousands of fire ants. When only low natural cavities are left for these birds then most of them in the south will perish. Fire ants were in five bluebird nests yesterday on parts of my trail and another bluebirder across the county. On Friday parts of our county received over three inches of rain in 30 minutes. This drives fire ants out of the ground and up poles, trees and bushes to escape the rising water. KK

Below is an excerpt from an article "Predators" on our website in the Education and Information Section, by Ron Kingston. I agree totally with him that birds nesting high up in a tree most likely are better protected. Just think about in the 1800's when they were seen in flocks of hundreds and we had no nestboxes with predator guards, no freshly mowed fields and lawns.

However, I think there is a difference in placing a nestbox on a limb or immediately under a tree than the cavity being high up in the tree. Hold on a minute. It does work for Linda. However, where I am in LA, I cannot get them to nest in nestboxes close to a tree or under it (have had to move several) and also we have to constantly fight the huge long snakes that do climb the trees and go out on the limbs. You can include us in the northeast as far as not putting them in trees on limbs.

All of this said, I do have great success with mine out in the open because I am a diligent monitor and stay ahead of problems that have occurred in the past. To me, that is the big factor, watching and staying ahead of it and doing what you can.

We will never have those good old days with all the natural cavities again.

Evelyn Cooper ...

"In attracting bluebirds away from cryptic natural cavities to conspicuous nestboxes, we are in a sense setting them up for predation. The incubating female, potential mother to dozens of offspring, might slip unnoticed into a tree hole, but less secretly to a box out in an open field. She is at special risk and her death impacts the breeding potential of local population. Should we put up nestboxes at all? Yes, but only if we accept the responsibility that goes with them, to monitor and protect them from predators."

From: Wendell Long [mailto:mrsimple33"at"go-concepts.com]
Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:23 AM
Subject: Old Oak Tree

Friends, I want to give testimony about my old cavity nesting Oak tree. It is about half dead much like me so we have alot in common. But it is much older than my 71 years and it is much bigger than my 145 pounds. And it has many more cavities. When I am bored, which is about every day, I make a visit down to the big road and visit with the old Oak and take a few snapshots of the bird of the day. Most of the cavities are about 50 plus feet up from the ground so I usually have a stiff neck. In the last few weeks I have observed many different species using this tree--including woodpeckers(Pileated, Red-headed, Red-bellied, Downey, Hairy). Others using the tree include Crow, Hawk, Nuthatch, Chickadee, Tufted. But to see the neatest of all, please observe the photo in this link to a shot in my photo bucket. Yep, Eastern Bluebird checking out a roosting spot(an old woodpecker hole about 50 ft above ground) for the winter time. Or perhaps they live there year around. I only visit in nice fall and spring weather. Thanks for hearing me out. It was nice talking to you. Wendell Long Waynesville, OH PS: Click this link for the blues checking out the Old Oak Tree. http://photobucket.com/albums/v283/MrSimple/?action=view¤t=BBOldOakOct03.jpg

From: Burnham, Barbara [mailto:Barbara.Burnham"at"zzz.zzz]
Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 8:17 AM
RE: Old Oak Tree

Great pic Wendell! As always! It looks like those bluebirds are having quite a disagreement! Or are they amazed at what they found inside? LOL We have a very old (and VERY tall) Tulip Poplar nearby that has a lot of cavities. This summer, it hosted several broods of European Starlings...Ugh. A pair of Red-Shouldered Hawks took turns breaking off dead branches to build their nest nearby. Pileated and other woodpeckers are of course frequent visitors. It is amazing how many creatures visit and use a dead or dying tree. I can watch this tree from my window, and recently, I watched a flock of bluebirds take turns popping in and out of these cavities. So many bluebirds went in, and then out, I lost count. (It reminded me of the clowns that all fit into the tiny Volkswagen.) But maybe the cavities join somehow inside the tree. More fun than the circus--for a birdwatcher. Barbara Burnham Ellicott City, MD

From: JoAnn Gossett [mailto:supertiger"at"bellsouth.net]
Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2004 11:51 AM
Re: Old Oak Tree

To all, I must admit that I miss my dead trees. When we lived in CT we always kept some trees that were dead or dying. They were a constant source of joy, especially when the newest of the babies started to poke out their heads. Here in FL. our lot has on smaller trees and there isn't anything really close which is dead. When Ivan came through I counted my blessings. We only lost a few small trees. My daughter Tammy has at least 25 trees that are down, not counting what she can't see in the deep woods. I'm sure she'll keep a couple of the broken oaks as long as they're away from the house. The damage to her property is quite a bit, but at least she didn't get a direct hit from the trees. She was hit with a spin-off tornado. Have a good day, JoAnn Gossett

From: Wendell Long [mailto:mrsimple33 "at"go-concepts.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 5:20 PM
Subject: Cavity Nesting Host Tree

Seen here is today's sunrise out my front door near the Caesar Creek Gorge. The old Oak tree is host to many cavity nesters including nuthatch, downy, pileated, flicker, red-bellied, etc. Wendell Long http://photobucket.com/albums/v283/MrSimple/?action=view¤t=Sunrise1127.jpg

From: Shawn [mailto:shawnee4"at"charter.net]
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 8:33 PM
Subject: Unique Situation?

Apparently in Jan. or Feb., a Woodpecker pecked a perfectly round hole in the siding on the right side of our house, about five and a half feet above the ground.. We thought it had a nest in there. I saw a Chickadee fly out of the hole over the weekend, so it is Chickadees. When I am in our master bathroom, I can hear them peeping and scratching around. I got up on a ladder (I'm only 5' 3" tall) with a flashlight, but that hole goes way down, and I couldn't see a thing. It is actually probably an ideal "birdhouse", except I have no way to monitor it to know how many babies there are. We have another CACH family in a birdhouse we built for them, so I'm going to go with the assumption that the babies are about the same age, and when I see them fledge, will pay special attention to the "house" in our house's siding. My husband will probably leave the hole there until this nesting season is over (don't want to seal any birds up in the wall like an avian version of the Edgar Allan Poe story, you know)! Has anyone else encountered something like this?

Shawn in Sevierville, TN

Shawn, you can monitor the cavities with a bit of ingenuity. Get an 'inspection mirror' from your local hardware or home improvement store, a small (7/8", 1" or 1.25") mirror mounted on a swivel at the end of a metal shaft. Professional ones used by home inspectors are expensive but handyman models are under $5 (I paid $3.95 for my latest one earlier this year). They're used to look in walls before demolition to be sure a handman doesn't damage wiring or plumbing inside walls.
Tape a penlight with a narrow focused beam to the shaft of the mirror and angle the mirror at about a 45 degree angle. Since you're looking at a different angle, the penlight will light up the inside of the cavity for you. You can see what's down there if you get your eye real close to the hole although some momma birds cover their eggs when they leave the nest. I'm monitoring natural cavities this way.

I've heard of other people using dental mirrors and that should work if you know a friendly dentist. Their disposable mirrors are under a dollar each in the quantities that they buy and you can even wash off used ones for checking on birds.

There are more expensive lighted and fiberoptic inspection devices costing from $40 to hundreds of dollars. I'm not willing to spend that much since the inexpensive mirror works fine.

Almost every crack and crevice in my home and barn is claimed by an English House Sparrow or European Starling rather than a native bird. I do have birds nesting in odd places, though. A pair of Song Sparrows chose to nest in a stack of straw bales under the lean-to on the back of the barn (straw that was supposed to be shredded as mulch for my garden [grumble]). I stacked it criss-cross leaving about 2" air space to be sure it dried well over the winter and the native sparrows took advantage. It's a beautiful and cozy nest in an unusual place for the species.

I've managed to eliminate most of the HOSP and EUST by first cleaning out the cavities where they nest and then dealing with the birds who usually find their way into a dedicated trap.

Take care,

R J 'Tree' Greenwood
Catlett VA

Tree,

Thank you! I will try it, maybe the cavity isn't as deep down as I think. From the outside, it is 5.5 feet up the side of the house. In the master bath, they are at ear-level in the wall it sounds like.

Shawn in Sevierville, TN

Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
One of our customers called last week frantic that they had failed an inspection and needed a couple of truck bays repaired. They ship out product from a refrigerated building and the black foam seals that 18 wheel tractor trailer rigs back into were torn and not sealing out light when the trailers were pressed into the 12" x12" thick foam seals.

We got on the job and there was a trailer parked in the one slot from 9 AM until 3:30 PM. We finished other jobs and finally got to tear out the old truck seals at 5 PM. Just as the top seal was coming down we noticed a bird nest wedged up in the torn bottom of the seal 12 feet off of the ground and under an awning...When the seal hit the ground and old House Sparrow nest fell out of the seal and also a brand new bluebird nest with two fresh eggs fell out.

This nest got squished every time a trailer was backed into this truck bay.
When the trailer was in the bay the birds would be trapped or at least the nest would be blocked not allowing the adults access to the nest for it would be only accessible from inside the trailer or from inside the cooler.
So as your population of bluebirds increase they will be forced to use their imagination and build their nests in non- natural cavities or choose something other than a nestbox. KK

From: RBALTRUNAS"at"cs.com [mailto:RBALTRUNAS"at"cs.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: I needed a camera yesterday!

This is an issue to think about. Since joining this email line, we have had some mention of how HOSP can grow from one pair (2) to over a thousand in 5 years under ideal conditions. Well, this math applies to all birds. Their mathematical growth rates may differ due to nest type and availability, number of broods, size of broods, survival rates and territorialty. I don't accept Darwin's explanation for the design of living organisms, but minor changes can and will occur. A secondary cavity nesting type of bird might start to nest in more open sites and their young will be imprinted and they will be more flexible. Some species today, particularly those that nest on beaches like Least Terns need this to survive the ounslaught of humans. They have eveolved a little by nesting on gravel rooftops, but these are being phased out. Man makes changes that are too rapid .

Ron
Brooksville, FL

You better believe they will harass the Bluebirds until they abandon the territory. I have seen them flog them away from the nestbox and land on top of it themselves. This one Mocker would go screaming from one tree to the other all over the yard, trying to intimidate the pair. It did intimidate them for about three years to where there was no bluebird nesting in my backyard. However, this male Bluebird and his lady love are so aggressive that they ran them off and have nested in the backyard now for two summers.
This Mockingbird would sit on the outer edge of the yard trying to sing like a Bluebird only very loud and slightly off key at times.

You can only hope for aggressive Bluebirds and run out screaming if the Mockers get close to the box. That won't bother the Bluebirds.

Good luck,

Evelyn Cooper, Dehli, LA

From: Christy [mailto:ke4fej1"at"email.msn.com]
Sent: Tuesday, June 07, 2005 7:20 PM
Subject: Hair in Nests Interesting
From my M 7 Trail:

Just a side note: We have a mockingbird nest in the bushes right outside our pool cage. There are three eggs in it. We always comb our dogs and put the hair outside because I read somewhere that some birds use it in their nests. I never had proof of this until now. The mockingbird nest is lined with our dogs' hair! How cool is that?!!!

Neat... and interesting that people are taking notice of what is going on around them!

Christy Sarasota, FL

Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
Most fruit trees are not native to the America's but were imported from China, Persia, Turkey ETC. Ever since Johnny Appleseed began his crusade to spread the apple trees across the Northeast humans and wildlife have benefited from the shade and food that these trees produce. Apples especially provide a host plant for dozens if not hundreds of "pest" insects that are especially tasty to our cavity nesters.

Historically old apple orchards were claimed to be a Mecca for the Eastern Bluebird to nest in. Supposedly old apple orchards provided cavities in the old tree trunks and the leaves attracted a wide assortment of caterpillars during the very early spring and summer months and the orchards were grazed by livestock or mowed creating the short grass areas with grasshoppers and crickets that the bluebirds preferred. ...

Anyway I traveled to Atlanta Georgia this past week for the Board Meeting of The North American Bluebird Society and drove the back roads of South Carolina and up into North Carolina in search of old apple orchards. ...

Along the back roads you can sometimes find some of these antique varieties still being grown. As the paved road changed to gravel and then to dirt and then just two tire tracks in the grass I found the old orchard I was looking for. Huge gnarled old apple trees that were abandoned. They were too big and too close together for modern picking methods. Rotten fruit covered the ground so thick it was killing the grass. The air was filled with the bitter sweet scent of apple cider or vinegar depending on which way the hot breeze was blowing. The air was filled with wasps, bees and hornets. Flies and moths and butterflies were digesting their apple cider meal on the sunny sides of the tree trunks. Sun glanced off the clear insect wings creating the different colors of the rainbow as colorful butterflies flexed their wings in what seemed like a slow motion, silent wing clapping.

Anyway the trunks of the trees had what I was looking for. Cavities large enough for bluebirds and other small birds to nest in. Not just one or two in the old orchard but sometimes three or four in each trunk! Where limbs had been pruned off or broken off in storms the trunk grew around the limb to create a fairly small entrance hole that ballooned out into a wonderful cavity 4">6" in diameter and 4>12" deep depending on how the rotted sawdust had been removed by some woodpecker or chickadee years if not decades ago....

Did you know that Pileated Woodpeckers LOVE to eat pears? Enjoy a little bit of nature this weekend and leave the cores in the woods for the wildlife. KK

Hi, Torrey:

That's nothing ... for the past two years, I have had a pair of scissor-tail flycatchers in one of my bluebird boxes and a pair of eastern bluebirds that absolutely insist on nesting in a discarded flower pot (FYI - this flower pot is barely 30 feet from an unused bluebird box). Don't they know that every bird book we have strictly prohibits this type of housing tenure for their respective species!
Hahaha!

Maybe we are all just witnessing avian behavioral evolution ...
extremely up close! I for one very much enjoy hearing about all of the "exceptions" that we all encounter on a regular basis.

Have a great day,
David

I agree, David, the exceptions are neat to hear about!

We have some pictures on our site that Keith sent to us where bb's were nesting in a goose neck trailer, I think it was.

Also, we have some wonderful close-ups of bluebirds in a natural cavity by Kerry Sweet of OK.

Evelyn

Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant....

I have some pretty good photo's of bluebirds nesting in the corner of a beauty parlor. Also nesting in electric switch boxes and other electrical boxes. Natural wood cavities are harder to get photo's of the nest because very often they are too deep or too dark for photo's. Bird nests are easy to find built in the "neck" of Goose neck trailers. I found a nest of bluebirds in an old abandoned house where they entered a broken window and nested inside the people house on the window ledge. They also are known to use Barn Swallow nests under bridges or on building walls. They also use Cliff Swallow nests.

On the island of Bermuda they nested in abandoned American Robin nests in the forks of trees. I see them often nesting in the rafters of steel metal buildings. They will nest on the floor of elevated deer hunting "stands" as will vultures if they can enter through the windows. These are not really "natural" cavities but it is important to understand where they will nest if they cannot find a nestbox.

We used to get pallets of concrete blocks from our local lumber store and we would find bluebird nests inside the open cavities in these blocks where the birds were nesting in the store parking lot until I placed nestboxes all around the lumber yard.

Gary Springer sent me photos of bluebirds nesting in a hole in a brick building downtown Georgia somewhere. Just like you would find House Sparrows or Starlings.

If you will drive around in the country in a few weeks in the south you can find bluebirds sitting on power lines. Within minutes they will drop down for food and then head directly to their nest. You would be amazed at the types of places that they find "naturally" in areas when they want to nest.

Yesterday a male bluebird was singing and calling for a mate. The landowner clear cut 100 acres and they pushed the tree tops in some areas up in huge piles getting ready to burn. The male bluebird kept going into a "cavity"
near the top of the pile where logs were tightly packed but left a small covered space to build a nest. KK

Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
I looked at a job site late last week and a male bluebird was calling for a mate from the top of a large Elm tree next to our fire station. It is a living tree that has been broken up in ice storms and wind storms and about half the limbs are broken off leaving stubs. Anyway this week I have watched the now pair of bluebirds carry nesting material into what looks like a Red Bellied Woodpecker cavity about 28 feet off the ground in a south facing entrance hole.

Anyway here I am, skipping lunch way up in the top of a tree above the top of a 24 foot extension ladder doing important research work when I hear this voice. WHAT THE H%&#"at" ARE YOU DOING CLIMBING IN A TREE??? YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO BE DOWN HERE BUILDING OUR NEW PUMP BUILDING??? DON'T YOU CARE THAT I HAVE TO GET WATER INTO THE CITY POOL BY THE 22 nd OF THIS MONTH.

He pretty well screamed all of the words but he still managed to put more emphasis on some of the key words....I just LOVE city contracts you have to be the low bid, submit them months ahead of time and then they award them two weeks before the job MUST be completed....Of course he was still a little ticked off that we took a day off last week and were helping school kids build nestboxes right below the city swimming pool while he was up there sweating in the heat, we were playing in Dellwood Park and the job site was vacant.

I can't complain too much because he is the man who as acting city manager got me to install bluebird nestboxes in most of the city parks way back in 1988. Bluebirds are nesting all around this 36 acre city park and this pair of bluebirds chose a natural cavity.

I really had a nice day yesterday watching birds while I worked a little.
House Finches are relatively new in this area. They arrived in the 1980's to nest in our city and I never figured out if they spread from West Texas or from the birds released on the East Coast. Anyway I watched a pair feeding 5 babies in the elm tree with the bluebirds. A Crow came and wanted me to share peanuts with him at lunch and the bluebirds were not fazed that he was cawing just 15 feet from their new nest.

There was an Indigo Bunting calling from the top of this same elm tree all day yesterday. A pair of Red Tailed Hawks are feeding young across the road and a little down steam from the park creek. I had to take a fake water break when a pair of Kite's soared over the fire station and circled above the now empty city pool.....They hung a strong thermal and spiraled right above me for about 15 minutes. One was following the others lead and everytime it zigged the other zagged circling higher and higher. Above them there was a mixed flock of Cliff Swallows, Barn Swallows and a few Chimney Swifts.... An owl was hooting down the creek off and on all day. Anyway I need to go look up my kites as these did not look like the common Mississippi kites. They had way too much white on their backs and wing tops.

Lets see it is now 8:08 AM and I am supposed to be painting a new building.
GEEZ people need to concentrate on the REALLY important things in life. I think I'll go make a few more nestboxes for Dellwood park and put them up today.....They might even get a coat of city green paint:-))

Enjoy Mother's Day tomorrow since we all "mother" our birds whether they like it or not. KK

My Bluebirds started a second nest and then stopped. At first I thought maybe those might just be claim straws in the box, but guess what...my husband and I have seen them several times in and out of a small hole on the woodpecker tree. Perhaps they are thinking about building a nest in a natural cavity? That would definitely be something to watch. No sparrow spookers or peeking in at the nest; it would be completely natural. What a concept!

Susan Wenzel, Virginia Beach, VA

Ok , now I am disappointed. I saw the female BB pick up nesting material from my backyard and fly past my nestbox into the front yard and right into my neighbor's mailbox slot compartment. This is the slot below mailboxes where flyers go to. This is my neighbor directly across the street from me. The only thing I can think of is that they really do like my front yard since now their nest is facing it... except ofcourse there is a road in between . I don't know why they would pick it since there is hardly any privacy the hole is 4 inches by 8 inches wide so the nestlings will easily fall out . Plus some person might just stuff flyers into it .
Maybe I put out my nestbox too late? It looks like the nest is almost complete judging from the amount of nesting material in it and I just set up my nestbox last Saturday. I have the Gilbertson pvc , could it be the mailbox slot looked more appealing to them too?

Veronica, Richmond,Va

From: Donna [mailto:spraydm"at"earthlink.net]
Sent: Friday, June 23, 2006 6:54 PM
Subject: unused nestbox for EABL

Okay, so setting up a new box the day after my blues kicked the new pair of blues that attempted to nest in the paired box didn't work. No takers.

We're not done yet!

Today we noticed a bluebird nest in my brother-in-law's mailbox - actually in the opening underneath the mailbox for packages. It was all pine needles, and because there isn't much space, a very, very shallow cup all the way at the back. Not a good nest site, and very vulnerable to predators. My brother-in-law said he was going to throw it out in the morning.

So this evening we went down with our unused box, put it a few feet back from the mailbox in a shaded area, and transferred the nest into it. They were going to lose the nest anyway, at least this gives them a chance to take the new location. I hope they take it.

Donna

Hi Donna - ideally I think it is good to wait until there is one egg before making a move - makes it
more likely the parents will go where the nest is relocated to. Please let us know if the birds
accept the box (which I'm guessing they will - bluebirds are pretty tolerant of this kind of thing.)

As you probably know, it's a good thing your brother-in-law did not throw the nest out. It is
illegal (without a permit, which is almost impossible to get) to disturb an active nest of a native
bird, even if they chose a most inconvenient location. Adults, nests, eggs and young of NATIVE
birds are protected under the Migratory Bird Treaty Act. The Act provides for serious penalties,
both civil and criminal.

Of course some of the things bluebird monitors do (like a nest change when a nest is soaking wet or
infested) are technically violations of the Act also, but I've never heard of anyone enforcing the
law against these types of actions by experienced bluebird monitors.

Bet from CT

I have good news.

The bluebirds did accept the new box readily. When I looked at it this morning there was a very small and thin piece of nesting material hanging out of the door that wasn't there last evening. When I moved the nest into the box, the cup was extremely shallow because there is so little room in the lower part of the mailbox. The cup had been nicely shaped and deepened.
When I looked again this afternoon, there was a different piece of material, a larger pine needle hanging out the door.

I think it's very possible this is the pair that got kicked out of our paired box recently. Their feather colors are deeper and brighter than the pair nesting in my backyard, and we had noticed this coloring in the pair that were evicted, while they were courting and starting to build a nest here about 12 days ago. The male's color is a very brilliant blue, and the female has very velvety gray feathers and her blue feathers are a deeper blue.

Does the color difference have to do with age or getting ready for molting?

Donna

Egg #1 was laid today.

The birds accepted the box so quickly, and never tried to renest in the
mailbox slot at all. I'd like to think they are more comfortable, and I know
they are safer.

Donna

I feel so sorry for the bluebirds nesting in my neighbor's mailbox. I did tell my neighbor very nicely that there was a BB building a nest in her mailbox and she did remove it before the nest got completed. I don't think she really like the fact that I was "meddling" with her business but I felt it my duty at least to make her aware of the BBs. Anyway, the BBs decided to rebuild the nest the very next day and I think now they have eggs in them. Well this morning I saw some paper stuffed in it and I saw the 2 BBs frantically trying to get into the nest. I asked my hubby if I should pull the paper out but he told me it was a federal offense to do so...
Finally, I think the female BB was able to figure out how to navigate the paper blocking the entrance. I wish my neighbor will put a sign up that a bb is nesting in the mailbox slot so it won't get stuffed up but oh well...I don't want to tell her what to do again ...

Veronica
Richmond,VA

A few years ago, a neighbor had a similar thing happen. The bluebirds liked her newspaper chute and built a nest inside. It was open on both ends.
These neighbors wanted to help the bluebirds so I was asked to help. First, I installed a 2nd chute for their newspaper next to the original one. I then blocked one end of the original box that had the nest in it so the newspaper person wouldn't use it. It all worked out and four bluebirds fledged a while later.
It doesn't sound like your neighbor is receptive to helping bluebirds so that is too bad. Some people just aren't into nature. This doesn't sound good for those bluebirds over there.
Apparently the blues like this type of structure. Would it be possible for you to install a similar structure for them in front of your house? That way when the end comes for the bluebird's family plans over there, they will have an alternate place to build. There is still time.
Carol
Oxford, Michigan

Thanks for all the suggestions regarding this BB dilemma . I want to clarify one thing, it is actually the newspaper chute (I have found the right term for it... thanks Carol ), the slot below the main mailbox where the BBs are nesting. This is where people stick flyers and newspapers into. I know from another friend who had neighbors put signs up to say "Do not disturb bluebirds nesting"... I wish they would do the same.
I have a similar structure on my mailbox but I discovered that it had a wasp nest in it which I had since have my husband destroy. Anyway, I will hang around outside this weekend in the hope that I will catch my neighbor and casually mention the BBs again.
I don't want them to feel paranoid that might make them think I'm spying on their property... :) .
I saw the bb pair today and the male bb went inside the nest... does this mean that the eggs have hatched ?

Veronica,

Do you think your neighbor might be amenable to the gift of a nestbox installed next to her mailbox or even mounted on the back of it? Nest could be transferred to box if it is very close and I would think they should accept it. Just my two cents..

Paula Z
Powell (Central) Ohio

Paula,

I will try and talk to them this weekend. Our neighborhood has a lot of rules . Fencing ,landscaping and anything to be installed outdoors all need approval from the association.

Veronica

From: KCBSP"at"aol.com [mailto:KCBSP"at"aol.com]
Sent: Friday, June 30, 2006 12:18 AM
Subject: Re: Poor bluebirds

Hi Veronica,

I just wanted to add one thought. Paula has a really good idea here, just one thing might occur and that's a "might" if you put the nest box close to the mailbox. Hope you don't mind me saying Paula. I didn't think you would.

Most times the bluebirds are docile, but at times they will swoop to defend the box. If they nest too close they might swoop her getting her mail or the mailman! To me that would be great cause this light small bird won't hurt anyone, but lots don't know or understand it. I had some boxes at a state park and we had a box about 25 feet from the pontoon boat launch there. The tree swallows swooped the people waiting for a ride. The park made us move it. While I understand this, in a way and did what they wanted, where is nature to be if not in the state park? :D I could not believe how frightened these people were of a lil ole tree swallow. It's not like being swooped by a crow or something large.

One time about 8 years ago someone I got to know from the list had a box near a property line or something of that nature in a development. The neighbor used Chem Lawn and the technician got near this box. He ended up spraying down the bird.. poor lil bluebird for heavens sake!! How silly.. it's what 3 ozs 6 ozs Some people might think if you get a "swooper" that it is attacking their children!! NOT!! but ignorance is real.

Just give it a good look and see where the best spot is. I think they would take to the box very quickly. Geez I would be glad to see one in my mailbox. It would sure make me smile but that's me.

If you need pictures let us know.

One other thought might be to try a hanging box too.. great in developments no poles would probably work if they won't allow it if a tree is near the mailbox area.

Kathy Clark, New Cumberland, PA

Thanks for your suggestions Kathy :) . I would see what I can do this weekend . Our association has a newsletter and I am thinking that for next year before spring , I will write an article about birds nesting in the mailboxes or in herb boxes (I had a successful nesting of mourning doves right outside my deck herb planter :)) . I would suggest that responsibility is involve once you allow a bird to nest on your property . One is to avoid using pesticides and secondly weekly monitoring of the nest is necessary. I will also mention the offering of an alternate nestbox that is more secure. Lastly , I will mention that if you absolutely have no desire to take care of the birds then it would be best to deny access to the newspaper chute. One neighbor put a hard plastic cover on his to prevent the BBs from nesting.

Veronica
Richmond,VA

I wonder if I could use a flashlight to check for blowfly infestation. Would that scare the nestlings? I think it would be kind of tricky to pull out the nest out to check it so I was thinking of just lifting the nest a bit with some spatula and check underneath...
I'll see if my neighbor would let me monitor it for her in case she does not have the time to do it.

Veronica
richmond,Va

A sad end,by the way to my neighbors bb newspaper chute nesting . I saw eggs scattered on the ground...I think this was human predation , this was the weekend that my neighbors were out of town ... the weekend I was going to offer them a nestbox. I was too late :( .
The BBs abandoned the nest.

Veronica
Richmond, VA

Hi List,

Does anyone have any first hand experience of Bluebirds successfully nesting in natural cavities, or better yet, any photos?

I'm not good enough at statistics to accurately interpret the data I see on the North American Breeding Bird Survey, and the Christmas Bird Count doesn't let you search by our country (it doesn't list the US but does list US Minor Outlying Islands), and The Great Backyard Bird Count doesn't give me meaningful data.

What I'm getting at is this: Does anyone really know whether there are more or less Bluebirds or Tree Swallows since all our efforts began?
We see more because we put out nest boxes, but is there any solid scientific evidence that the population has really increased? We know what happens on trails, but how does that relate to nationwide trends?
Has anyone ever seen a reliable estimate on the population of Bluebirds in North America? I haven't. Not on the NABS web site or anywhere else. I'm just curious.

Thanks,
Rob Barron

Rob, I suspected that we had EABL nesting in natural cavities two years ago when the HOSP ran them away from the three nest boxes in our yard and barn yard. I closed up the boxes in despair, but a few weeks later while
horseback riding, I noticed three EABL in the woods on our farm. There are
several dead trees in our woods, and I've seen plenty of small, natural cavities; one that had clearly supported a nest, but it was too high for me to see in, plus I just have to see poison ivy, and I start to break out and
itch. That following winter, I fed mealworms and had one pair consistently
come to that feeder. So, my instinct tells me that EABL do retreat to the woods and utilize the natural cavities. But no hard evidence for you.

Trudy Pischer
Willard, MO

Thanks Trudy,
I suspect the same, but most natural cavities are hidden from view and most are taken over by European starlings and not so much by House Sparrows, at least from what I've seen. Thanks for the input. I'm looking forward to what others say.
Thanks,
Rob Barron

Rob, Bluebirds came for years around the edge of my yard and nested. I even had my box out for two years before they decided to venture away from the wonderful natural cavities I have all around me and investigate that little box.

I have all kinds of cavity nesters that nest in natural cavities including a pair of Pileated Woodpeckers that we see and they nest not far from my house. There's one tree in particular that looks like it has about 20 holes in it!

You can see some pictures of natural cavities including one in a fence post by KK on our website at www.labayoubluebirdsociety.org , click on "Pictures". Kerry Sweet has some nice shots of some on there too.

I would venture to say if we all took our nestboxes down, it would tell us the story you are looking for.

Evelyn

Hi Evelyn,

Well, that's great and interesting news. I certainly wouldn't recommend taking our nest boxes down because many of us don't live in as pristine areas of the country as you do. I think the biggest contribution we can make to native cavity nesters, specially secondary cavity nesters, is to give them more cavities that we make sure aren't taken over by invasive species like European Starlings and House Sparrows. There is no doubt in my mind that all the Bluebird helpers like you have increased the abundance of Bluebirds. I'm just wondering if we can find a scientific way of measuring the contribution we have made and apply that model to other secondary cavity nesters.

I had Pileated Woodpeckers all over my woods in upstate NY. They are magnificent birds and I haven't seen a HOSP or European Starling yet that will mess with them, but they have a size advantage, and can excavate their own cavities.

Thanks for the link to your pictures.
Rob Barron-Warrenton, Virginia

Rob wrote:

" What I'm getting at is this: Does anyone really know whether there are
> more or less Bluebirds or Tree Swallows since all our efforts began?"

Rob, this was in your first post. I think the answer is a great big yes! My statement saying if we took down all our nestboxes, we would certainly see what a difference we've made!!! The Bluebirds were near endangered species, but we've brought them away from that.

No, we could never take the boxes down, in fact, I have stated many times they are dependent on us because of the habitat disappearing so rapidly.

I don't know about Trees Swallows, but I think all the cavity nesters have to compete more for nesting places.

Re: The heat. I think my eggs in the front yard are not going to hatch. I think it is the heat. This box is in the shade except for 2 1/2 hours and has heat shields.

Also, in the nestbox with the 4th cycle, it was 102* today. However, if I had not had the solar screen and styrofoam on it, I am sure it would have been 108* degrees or more. I have doubts any of the eggs on this cycle will hatch.

Evelyn

Rob, I see Pileated Woodpeckers here, in addition to Downy, Red-Headed, and Red-Bellied Woodpeckers. So hopefully they are making plenty of cavities for the smaller birds. The Red-Headed is a gorgeous bird, and I love to watch it in flight. So colorful!

Most homeowners in our area leave their properties fairly heavily wooded, and don't clear out all the dead trees. We only cleared what we absolutely needed on our 3 acre lot, and left the rest natural. However, there is a new development going up a few miles away that took out quite a swath. :-(

I am trying to work up the nerve to ask the local paper to write up an article about this topic, and the need to replace the missing habitat with nestboxes and support.

Donna, VA

Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas Hey we got .31 inches of rain last
night:-))
This is pretty easy to go back to research the Canadians who were only finding a few pairs of bluebirds across entire provinces back in the 1950's and 60's. Charlie Ellis in Alberta and John and Nora Lane in (Manitoba &
Saskatchewan?) only had a pair or two and these were the ONLY ones reported by ANY birders in their areas. With the use of massive bluebird nestbox trails their trails fledged thousands over the next 40 years. Same goes for the Mountain Bluebird trails group. They went from fledging or even seeing only a hand full of bluebirds for the entire year to reporting an absolute explosion today.

I quote from a NABS letter from Mary Janetatos in 1984 when New York State had just proclaimed the First Annual Bluebird Week in the state. The island of Bermuda had just formed a "Bluebird Society". NABS (Mary and helpers had mailed out..."Another 500,000 educational brochures (Where have all the Bluebirds Gone?) have been mailed ((read this as a LOT of postage stamps.
These brochures gave detailed nestbox plans and monitoring instructions)).

"20,162 bluebirds were reported fledged last year from 12,730 nestboxes."

Spin forward to 1999 and Steve Eno worked with just ONE of hundreds of bluebird nestbox manufacturers to get monitoring data inserted into each box this company built and to change the Bluebird nestboxes a little to be "NABS APPROVED" this one company was selling MORE than 226,000 nestboxes EVERY year through 1998. Another nestbox producer one week later switched over his productions of 20,000 nestboxes a year to "NABS APPROVED" and began inserting an Info sheet in each nestbox.

Spin BACK to 1964 when my family moved to East Texas and I knew of four natural cavities with Eastern Bluebirds nesting in them. As the hollow trees blew down this is where I began my off property nestbox trail. At each of these sites a new wood box replaced the fallen cavity. Monitored nestboxes EXPLODED the local population of bluebirds in and around our area. I went from fledging 35 bluebirds to 135 bluebirds to 325 to 1235 by 1979 in just four years. I scattered nestboxes in and area 30 miles wide north/south to 40 miles wide east to west. In 1982 at my brothers landscape business we gave away a nestbox with every bare root fruit tree he sold and that year we gave away more than 600 wood nestboxes that I had built during the previous winter.

In the mid 1970's almost NO ONE at a bluebird program had seen a bluebird.
Today almost EVERYONE coming to a bluebird program has up nestboxes or has seen a bluebird in the LAST week. KK

We watched bluebirds nesting in a tree at a wildlife refuge here in Maryland this year. The remains of the tree, about a 12 foot high snag, was located on the shore of a lake. This was not in a "typical" woodpecker cavity. The birds actually nested on the very top of the dead trunk which was hollow and deep enough that when they would arrive and go down into the nest we would lose sight of them. Early on we saw them bring nesting material, and later, we saw the male bringing bugs to the nest site. It was pretty neat seeing them there.

--rudy

in maryland

BLUEBIRD-L:

I know of one anecdotal incident involving my Bluebird houses.
During two summers, Bluebirds ignored a pair of my houses in the back yard of an old farmhouse. Instead they chose to nest in a cavity in a big apple tree within 20' of the houses. I suapect that they had nested in that tree before I came along with my houses, and were in the habit.
On the opposite side of the house, however, in the front yard, they chose to nest in one of my houses. The folks who owned the farmhouse said that they had had nesting Bluebirds for many years, long before I showed up, so I can claim no credit here.

Bruce Burdett, SW NH

From: Brucemac1"at"aol.com [mailto:Brucemac1"at"aol.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 12:06 PM
Subject: Re: natural cavities and NABS

In a message dated 7/20/2006 9:28:59 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net writes:

Good Morning Keith.....

Thank you, once again, for the 'Pep Talk' and the brief recap of your own BB History. I'm awe-struck by your dedication and the personal commitment you've made.

Growing up in rural SE Michigan thru the 30's, 40's, 50's, etc., and being moderately aware of birds and other wildlife, thru those years, I cannot ever recall seeing a Bluebird. It wasn't until the late '80's when I actually saw my 1st Bluebird....!! Boxes, NABS & folks like you have certainly made a difference.

Do you know where I might be able to get a copy of "Where have all the Bluebirds Gone...?"

Bruce Macdonald, SW Ontario

From: Donna [mailto:spraydm"at"earthlink.net]
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2006 12:04 PM
To: bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu
Subject: babies have fledged

You may recall the mailbox nest that I moved into a proper bluebird nestbox at my brother-in-laws house.

I'm happy to report that the four babies have fledged.

Donna, VA

From: Lawrence Herbert [mailto:lherbert"at"4state.com]
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 7:06 AM
Subject: EABL nest size

The one Eastern Bluebird nest that I found this season not in a nest box was in a large mail box. The EABL nest was "regular size" and in a corner.

Good birding, Larry H. Joplin MO.

From: Donna [mailto:spraydm"at"earthlink.net]
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 7:27 AM
Subject: Re: EABL nest size

I also found a nest in the newspaper slot below a mailbox (the plastic mailboxes from Lowes) this year.

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=90944-1547-5412&lpage=none

The cup was normal-sized, at the back of the slot, and there was pine needles spread about4-5 inches toward the opening. The nest cup was not quite as deep as those in a nestbox, either because the EABL was not finished making the nest, or perhaps due to lack of headroom.

Donna

From: Keith & Sandy Kridler [mailto:txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2006 9:00 AM
Subject: bluebirds in a mailbox

Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
We often find bluebirds nesting in mailboxes or paper tubes even when there are "bluebird" nestboxes nearby. I have photo's of a family of bluebirds piled up in the back of a large mailbox. When I drove by the mailbox at 45 MPH all five baby bluebirds were sitting out on the open door of the mailbox watching the cars drive by just a couple of feet away. When I turned around and went back and stopped they rushed back to the very back corner of the mailbox and piled up one of top of the other....I came back about 15 minutes later and they were all sitting back on the door of the mailbox. As long as you kept moving in the car they would stay on the door. When you stopped they ran and hid....Of course a mailman came by once a day 6 days and week and shoved mail in their face:-)) I felt the birds were getting as close to the arriving food delivery from their parents as they could without falling out on the ground.

Back in the 1980's our mailman HATED the bluebirds! He said "my" bluebird people were "NUTS". He stopped and talked to my mother and I about the problems these birds were creating for him on just this one route. For example he said that just "Yesterday" Mr. Johnson was standing out by his mailbox and informed the mailman that for the next month or so he would NOT allow him to put mail inside the mailbox because the bluebirds were laying eggs in there.

They got into an argument when the mailman refused to drive up Johnson's driveway and hand deliver the mail!!! For the next month the mailman was going to drive by Johnson's mailbox and THROW his mail out the window of his car....He said quite a few of the people on the mail route actually bought new mailboxes and left the old broken mailboxes up for the bluebirds.

Our mailman actually did not hate the bluebirds as he had up four or five nestboxes at his house he just hated it when he could not convince these new bluebirders that the birds would not abandon their nests just because he was putting mail up against the nests everyday. He really did believe some of them were "NUTS" though. He brought me a letter once that was only addressed, "The Bluebird Man, Mt. Pleasant, Texas". KK

From: Tree Greenwood [mailto:doctree"at"crosslink.net]
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 11:25 AM
Subject: Entry Holes (was "Re: Bergmanns Rule and hole depth")

On Wed 17 Jan 2007 at 13:28, "Bet Zimmerman"
<ezdz"at"charter.net> wrote:
> There is a wealth of data out there, but I'm not sure how much of it
> has been mined. ...{snip}
>
> The only natural cavities I have seen chickadees using (I'm not very
> observant though) are hollowed out, rotten fence pots that are open on
> the top.

Hi, Bet & everyone,

From my observations of natural cavities, birds are opportunistic, taking whatever is available when the urge to reproduce hits. In the past, I wrote about Bluebirds in Kestrel boxes and such.
House Sparrows will take any cavity or protected space such as behind business signs and between the supports and roof of the covered walkways at a local elementary school. Bluebirds happily take over Purple Martin houses before the Martins arrive and will often move into newspaper and mail boxes. Natural cavities come in just as wide a variety of sizes. I had Carolina Wrens nest in a cavity in the middle of a stack of straw bales.
All of the woodpecker holes that I measured in snags near my home have holes larger than 1.5"
and most are over 2", allowing Starlings to take over the cavities.

A pair of Downy Woodpeckers are busy excavating in a Maple in my front yard. Their entry hole is over a foot tall and 9 or 10" wide, the spot where a large branch broke off during an ice storm a few years ago. The collar was damaged so rot set in.
The inside of that mature Maple is rotting. The tree's trunk is almost 2 feet in diameter where the cavity is being excavated. I should probably cut the tree down even though it still greens up.
I definitely won't park the car under it. I'll let the old tree stand because so many birds call it home.

It's going to be interesting to examine the cavity once the woodpeckers finish their work. I haven't decided yet if I'm going to try making a cover or plug with a small entry hold to put over the giant hole to exclude Starlings or let nature take its course. Has anyone tried modifying a natural cavity's entry hole?

Starlings took over all of the woodpecker cavities in the other Maple snag that is now rotting away.
This will be the last year that any part of that old snag will be suitable for nesting. The center of that 20" diameter trunk was rotted so the entry tunnels to the natural woodpecker cavities were often 8" or more long before the nest cavity was reached (actually measured with my telescoping examination mirrors). As the trunk rotted from the inside out, the entry tunnels got shallower but none were less than 3" long.

As far as I can tell, only woodpeckers and one pair each of Great Crested Flycatchers and White Breasted Nuthatches successfully nested in the woodpecker cavities in that snag. Other native birds including some Chickadees tried but were evicted by Starlings before I could get a good shot at the exotic invasive killers.

I've watched natural cavities and attempted to monitor them for quite a while. When comparing successful nesting rates, birdhouses fledge far more birds.

Examining and monitoring nests in natural cavities is interesting but I don't think that there's much value in trying to build birdhouses that duplicate natural cavities. Take the good like thick walls and reject the bad like oversize entry holes.
Then experiment and read about the experience of other folks to create good homes for birds.

Take care,

R J 'Tree' Greenwood
Catlett VA

From: Bar JW Farm [mailto:barjwfarm"at"msn.com]
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 12:24 PM
Subject: Re: Entry Holes (was "Re: Bergmanns Rule and hole depth")

ok. I just have to share (although I confess I may be off-topic)

A favorite place for my wrens to nest is in the old cow skulls that I hang for decoration around the ranch house. It is too cute - They go to great lengths to find these choice nesting places, too - I have one mounted in the bar-bq house and have to open the screened door for the babies when they fledge. :)

Bluebirds were attracted to the supergourds I put up for the (still) non-existant martins although I think the starling resistant hole was the final deterrant that kept them from actually nesting in one. I quickly mounted a bluebird house near the gourds and while the bluebirds didn't nest in the birdhouse that season, they did so the next.
Danged pecking sapsuckers keep hacking up the eaves to the main house - sheesh! I'm running out of hardware cloth!

-diane