Problems with house sparrows on the bluebird trail (Part 8)

Active Control (Traps, Guns, Hooks, Oil, Pricking, Egg Removal, etc.)

Also see other HOSP information under Passive Control, Philosophy, Lime, General, Disposal, etc.

In addition to Messages that have appeared in the Bluebird Mailing Lists on this topic, the following are on the Audubon Society of Omaha website: 

From: Bruce & Linda Jenkins, ljenkins1"at"cox-internet.com
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 11:18 AM
Subject: Thank you for your support First I want to thank you all for your support the last few years. I am a disabled Vet and the traps you all have purchased has really improved my life, Thank you.

Now for the request. All year I sell about 5 traps a week. They are made to order so it is a comfortable pace until the Blue Birds start nesting and HOSP start raiding nests. Now I do not mind the extra work but last year my turn around time got as high as 20 days - it was the best I could do with the extra load. I am a nice guy and it did upset me more than I can express when I got letters saying I was responsible for there Baby Blue Birds being killed because the trap did not get there fast enough! If you think there is the slightest chance you will need a trap for your trail this year please order early. To encourage you I am providing a link to my personal page were you can save $5.00 compared to my eBay listings. If you do not use Paypal take another $2.10 off. So if you order through http://www.angelfire.com/ar2/rojo1/trap.html or this email with a check or money order you can get the trap for $23.50. I hope I have not stepped out of bounds as far a solicitation on this list but I really am trying to save a few fledglings and avoid displeasing you wonderful people.

Bruce Jenkins 21256 Oak Park Lane Siloam Springs Ar.72761 (479) 736-1601

From: Keith & Sandy Kridler, txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net
Sent: Friday, February 06, 2004 8:40 AM
Subject: 1950's China and the sparrow Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas

In the 1950's China could not feed, clothe or provide shelter or safe drinking water for their 500 million (approximate) people. They declared a "WAR" on the four "evils" that were depriving them of basic food and health. The four "evils" were rats, sparrows, flies and mosquito's. (Remember that there was no access for them at this time to the first real insecticide DDT.) For the "evil" sparrows; I assume that they included ALL of the species of sparrows and other birds that ate ANY grain because these birds were destroying tons of grain; rice, wheat, oats ETC. while many Chinese were starving to death. For several days they coordinated a country wide campaign where from dawn till dark the peasants went out into the streets and fields and pastures beating on pots and pans and screaming at the tops of their lungs when they found birds, driving the "evil" sparrows into the air. The panicked birds had never seen anything like this and they were driven into flocks that began circling their home territories, every time they tried to land in trees they were driven back into the air until lactic acid build up in the birds muscles had them dropping like flies from the sky where the peasants gathered them up by the thousands. (I assume that sparrows and rice were served all across the country!)

This worked so well that for "many" years they had NO problems with the "evil" sparrows! BUT maybe by chance or maybe by disturbing the ecological balance China was DEVASTATED by hordes of "locusts" (a species of grasshopper that historically exploded in population when conditions are right) the very next and several succeeding years and the locusts ate or destroyed far more grain than the "evil" sparrows had EVER destroyed and this led to even more widespread disease and famine all across China in the 1950's. ... KK

From: Gary Springer, springer"at"alltel.net
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 1:09 AM
Subject: Chinese house sparrow extermination methods

I'm amazed no one has questioned the feasibility of this method of house sparrow control. Or, did I miss something?. This is positively Chinese myth. I'd like to see people chase even one house sparrow until it fell from the sky. If shouting and banging pans is all that is done, I'd bet on the sparrow even if it were trapped inside a Home Depot with 200 screaming people. One of the screaming people would die first.. Gary

From: Keith & Sandy Kridler, txbluebirder"at"sbcglobal.net
Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 10:31 AM
Re:Chinese House Sparrow extermination method Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas

The last two years we live trapped house sparrows in the spring for a "behavioral" research professor at the University of Texas. The sparrows had to be alive for them and we would trap them in nestboxes and release the sparrows into one of my greenhouses until we got enough of the sparrows for them to drive 5 hours one way to pick them up. To catch 40 or 50 live sparrows in a 50 foot long greenhouse it is easier with two people, you simply stand one person at each end and wave a towel to get them flying in a flock. They circle the greenhouse in a frenzy about 10 times and begin to get tired. As they start dropping down and hiding in the corners you simply pick them up. Two people in about 15 minutes can catch 50 sparrows and the last ones are too scared or tired to even hop....

There is a HUGE difference in birds free flying outside on their own and those whose bodies have received a massive shot of adrenalin! Birds can fly hundreds of miles during migration but it takes weeks of eating correctly and building up reserves and muscle tone. My son Shawn can easily run down any of his or his friends free ranging bantam chickens in just a couple of minutes. The hawks and falcons they use in vineyards to frighten the starlings are only up flying about 45 minutes and then they let them rest and use another hawk. Each vineyard falconer will wear out up to 10 hawks a day! Swallows and swifts would be harder to "run down".

It is interesting that you mention "Wal-Mart sparrows". I have spent hours on the phone with a man who actually travels hundreds of miles a month capturing house sparrows in "Wal-Mart" type stores. It takes 4 men with four poles with small flags or ribbons on the ends to capture a sparrow inside a huge super market. He charges $1,200.00 for one hour as this is the maximum amount of time a sparrow can elude his crew. By this time the sparrow has either hidden in a hole that they cannot reach or they have caught the entire flock. He is required to capture and release them unharmed now but when allowed to use a pellet gun it took on average 15 minutes to exterminate an inside flock. A house sparrow can ruin $600.00 worth of people food a week in a grocery store....

From: Haleya Priest [mailto:mablue"at"gis.net]
Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2004 8:22 PM
To: Bluebird-L
Subject: FW: Sparrow ground trap

Haleya Priest Amherst MA – where we're supposed to get a foot of snow by tomorrow!
     Here is a question about making your own sparrow ground traps. Anyone have an answer? I'd appreciate it. :-) H
I have 6 Bluebird nest  boxes equipped with sparrow traps that I made. These traps work very good but I also want to construct a ground trap. I can find ground traps for sale, but I want to make my own. I can find plans online for nest boxes and traps for nest boxes, but I haven't found plans for ground traps. The NABS site says they are easy to construct, but doesn't offer any plans that I can find. Do you have any plans or know where I can finf some online?
Thank You
Carl Davison

From: Bruce & Linda Jenkins, ljenkins1"at"cox-internet.com
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 3:13 PM
Subject: RE: Sparrow ground trap (Bruce Jenkins sells an effective HOSP ground trap)

http://www.angelfire.com/ar2/rojo1/trap.html This is a direct ordering site for my traps.  You can also purchase them on eBay but for a little more to cover commissions and fees. http://groups.msn.com/WildbirdsandBiosecurity  this is an interactive site I maintain for anyone (not just customers) to discuss tricks to using traps and any kind of HOSP suppression.  As Dr. Bob has illustrated a good trap is only half the battle the rest is savvy and intuition. Best regards and thanks for thinking of my traps for this thread Dr. Bob  Bruce Jenkins Siloam Springs Ar. 72761

From: Snoopy, snoopy"at"wmis.net
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 3:20 AM
Subject: Sparrow trap question

Just curious if anyone knows, does this kind of trap really work????

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2390064646&category=20540

I only had one or two sparrows last year, but already have several around here making me so mad. They already scared the blues from one box. UGH.

Joy in Michigan ...

From: John Schuster, wildwingco"at"earthlink.net
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: Sparrow trap question

Dear Snoopy, Dottie and Friends,

Presently, I've knocked off 2 male HOSP this year, in our version of the Huber Box Trap that we call the Gable Trap.

John Schuster ...

From: Paula, PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 11:59 AM
Subject: House Sparrow Predation

The earlier post about nest box height and house sparrow (HOSP) predation got me thinking and I thought I would share my observations with the list on this subject. If my thought process is flawed in any way, I know you will set me straight. I believe I have learned quite a bit about these birds because we have an abundance of them. I have two bluebird boxes in my small suburban yard. One of my boxes faces a sergeant crabapple tree that I have (not so affectionately) named "The Sparrow Tree". This tree almost always harbors between 10 - 20 HOSP and this tree is only 30 feet from the box. This box has fledged two successful broods of EABL in the past two years without any losses and the mother EABL has an excellent view of these HOSP every day as she sits in her box. They are ONLY 30 feet away, but no problems since I have employed some of the techniques I'll mention (or I could be lucky, but don't think so). I also have learned a bit about HOSP interactions with other birds in close proximity because most of the boxes on my 21-box trail are paired. This is the third year for the trail. The boxes are paired a little too close (5 - 10 feet apart) and I hope to space them a little farther this spring. Having them this close, however, has allowed me to see the results of my monitoring intervention on HOSP behavior. I have made some mistakes over the past couple of years that have resulted in HOSP predation on adjacent native nesting birds. I have tried to adopt the mindset of trying to think like a HOSP before I intervene in a given situation. I obviously don't know exactly what they are thinking, but some of my interpretations might be close. So here are Paula's rules for HOSP control. If you have HOSP in your area:

1. DO NOT put up only one nest box. You need to have an empty nest box for the HOSP to go to. Otherwise, he will evict your nesting EABL: killing eggs, young and any adult in the box. In my experience, if there is an empty box within reasonable proximity (one in front yard and one in back for example), the HOSP will go to that box rather than confronting Papa Blue.

2. DO NOT remove HOSP nesting material until you have captured and killed the male HOSP. I made this mistake in the past and had HOSP enter box of adjacent nester and pierce and remove the eggs. I have made this mistake twice and will not do it again. You may have to remove part of the nest to have room to set your inbox trap. If you do, remove the lower half of the nest so that when he looks in, it looks familiar. As soon as the male is gone, trap and nesting material should be removed to get ready for HOSP #2 (I had 17 HOSP in one of my boxes the first year doing this). The female (in my experience) abandons the box after her man is gone.

3. DO NOT remove HOSP eggs (if you let it get this far) until you have captured and killed the male HOSP as described above. If I were a HOSP and found my nest or eggs missing, I might attribute it to the antics of another bird because other birds can do this. This is why I think the HOSP then goes to adjacent nest box and destroys the eggs or young of the native nester. My goal is not to piss him off. My goal is to eliminate him.

4. DO NOT let HOSP breed in your boxes.

5. DO trap and get rid of the HOSP as soon as possible. My favorite inbox trap is Mr. Van Ert's Universal Sparrow Trap and can be purchased through his website at: http://www.vanerttraps.com/universal.htm

6. When trapping, if you capture the female HOSP, DO reset your trap immediately as the male will be along shortly.

7. After you capture the male HOSP, DO remove all nesting material and trap from the box.

8. After capturing a HOSP, DO quickly and humanely dispatch the animal. I use thoracic compression, and other methods are explained in Bet's excellent website: http://www.sialis.org/hospdispatch.htm

9. DO recycle the HOSP if possible. Put them in freezer immediately after dispatch. Our local wildlife rehab center really appreciates this food source for injured Cooper's Hawks (they have 5 there right now). These hawks are used to eating birds in the wild, and not very fond of the mice that are fed to the raptors at the center. It is very important that no chemicals (car exhaust, etc.) be used and no BB's or pellets. Call your local wildlife rehabber first to see if they can use them.

From: Haleya Priest
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 1:20 PM
Re: House Sparrow Predation

Excellent! And also to add, HOSP know how to break rules, so even with all your wonderful methods, still no bluebirds are safe from HOSP, especially if it is a rogue HOSP who can't find a mate. :-) H

From: "Snoopy"
Subject: Sparrow trap question
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2004

Just curious if anyone knows, does this kind of trap really work???? http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2390064646&category=20540 I only had one or two sparrows last year, but already have several around here making me so mad. They already scared the blues from one box. UGH. Joy in Michigan

From: Paula, PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: Sparrow Trap Question

Joy, For your purposes, because you only had a couple HOSP last year, the perfect trap for you is an inbox trap. You will not need to use ground traps unless you have a lot of HOSP (like me). If HOSP are chasing EABL from your box, have you observed a HOSP either sitting on top or going into the box? If you have, he has claimed the box for his own and the only way to get rid of him is to trap him with an inbox trap. If you know he is sleeping in there, you can also sneak up on box at dusk or at night, plug hole with a rag, then carefully open box into large garbage bag. Or you can open a crack while blocking exit with one hand and reaching in and grab him. Best inbox trap I've ever tried is Universal Sparrow Trap by Van Ert and it is only $7.50: http://www.vanerttraps.com/universal.htm If you only have a couple of HOSP, a ground trap would be a huge waste of money. Catch them where they are causing the problem - in the nestbox. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Debi Money, dmoney"at"getatlas.com
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 6:51 PM
Subject: RE: Monitoring

Dear List, Please be grateful you have something to monitor. The #$%^& HOSP's succeded in running my beautiful BB's completely off! Paula, I tried what you told me, but I had one pair of HOSP's in the front and one pair in the back at the same time. Also, I did not succeed in killing the stupid things. What I wouldn't give for one of you sharp shooters to live close to me! In the midst of this I trapped BB's twice and a dear little chickadee once. So, between my stupid mistakes and all the hours I have to work I have been a failure so far. I have'nt seen BB's for days. They may be gone for good. The HOSP's faught the BB's directly untill they left. I have been learning though. So maybe in the future I will do better, I'm not giving up yet.

debi money, Spfld. MO, NABS member

From: Haleya Priest
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 7:31 PM
Subject: Re: Monitoring

Haleya Priest Amherst MA

Debi, so sorry to hear of your struggles! If I were you, I would consider purchasing a Gilbertson PVC box, or else put up another wooden box. If you have 2 pairs of house sparrows nesting, then putting up another box and that would give the bbs a chance.

THEN, you can work on the house sparrows (HOSP). I hate doing this, but it works: let the HOSP build and lay eggs. When she is incubating, catch her on the nest at night while she is sitting. Then put a trap in the box. Almost always the male comes in the morning to check out the eggs and will get trapped.

This system has been a life saver to me when all else failed. It works about 98% of the time.

The other is to seriously consider getting a gun. I have boxes set up near my windows, just for that purpose.

Others will also have ideas. Don't give up!!!!! You will be one of the best bluebirders if you can stick to it. Many of us have gone through what you have - and if you stick to it, you may well have success.

Some will suggest that if you have that many HOSP you shouldn't have bb boxes up. But from my own personal experience, if I get rid of the HOSP, I've been able to make it safe for my bb. Always knowing I'll have to work on the HOSP problem. :-) H

...Have your friend buy several different hole sizes while she's there, as nuthatches, chickadees and others use different size holes.  I learned a really sad lesson myself two years ago by watching a rogue male HOSP attack 2 week old nuthatches and I could have stopped it had I had on hand the correct hole restrictors! Here's my sad story from 2002, just so you can learn from my mistakes: from Donna in Marlborough, CT
Cold and rainy but no SNOW

Hello All,

A rogue male HOSP has been my teacher this week.  Because he flew into my yard, he motivated me to get off my duff and learn a few lessons, meet a nice rehabber, and become intimately acquainted with four ten-day old nuthatch nestlings.  Permit me to share with you some of my newfound knowledge:

I happened to witness the first nest raid by the rogue HOSP on the nuthatch nest. Both parents were very much in evidence and completely overpowered by the HOSP.  He blew into the nest and came back out quickly as I squawked and ran for the nestbox.  I opened the nestbox and found six live hatchlings and one freshly killed.  It had NO marks on it but it was obvious that its neck was broken.  (Lesson one:  the HOSP kills without marks sometimes--and unless you see it happening, you would think that baby bird died of natural causes.  Within four minutes that baby was ice cold and stiff, so one wouldn't know that it's neck was snapped. Hypothesis: when nestlings are found dead in the nest, apparently unharmed, it could be the work of a HOSP).  Of the six live hatchlings, one had a seriously pecked nasal opening and was bleeding.  The other five "looked" fine.  I left my son watching the nestbox and found a local rehabber (lesson 2: find the rehabber BEFORE you need them!)  After taking the baby to the rehabber,  I fretted but couldn't figure out how to protect the nuthatches from the HOSP as I had an unavoidable appointment and both my son and I had to leave the yard for two hours.  (Lesson three: have restrictor plates READY and WAITING so that you don't find yourself in the same mess I was in!  I now know that the nuthatch hole opening can be restricted to 1" thanks to a kind listmember who told me so.  This would have kept the HOSP out of the nuthatch nest, but would it have then turned its attention to the bluebird nest nearby?  It had already ignored a Van Ert PVC nest in my backyard, less than 70 feet from the nuthatches)  During the time I was out,  I made a stop to buy a third nestbox to try and move the nuthatches to so that the HOSP could take the box he wanted and leave the nuthatches alone.  I could only find a Peterson in the short time I allotted myself to shop.

When we returned, we opened the nextbox and found that the HOSP had just killed two more of the nuthatches, as they were still warm and had broken necks.  All three remaining live nuthatchlings had head pecks.  One of the three injured was pecked in the eye.  (Lesson four:  the HOSP broke the necks of the three smallest birds ( (I weighed all seven) but pecked the remaining birds).  [Question:  Why?  Hypotheses: the smallest were closest to the hole?  Hypotheses two: because they were the lightest, the HOSP could more easily pick them up and "fling" them to break their necks?  Hypotheses three: were these three of one sex, and the four pecked ones of another sex?  If so, any theories as to which was which?]

Taking the three injured ones to the rehabber, she cleaned them up and fed them and figured out that they were not very injured, mostly in shock.  Even the one that had the eye peck was ok: blood had sealed the eye shut but she cleaned it up and the eye opened.  One of their beaks was discolored and maybe bruised.  The rehabber gave me a lesson on feeding them (lesson five), gave me the correct food, and encouraged me to take the babies back to the parents by putting the original nest into the new Peterson nestbox about ten feet away.  I did try this with three of the nestlings and the old nest, but the parents would not approach the new nestbox.  Eventually I took the babies inside and began the incredibly interesting task of feeding the nestlings.

In the meantime, my husband outfitted the nestbox that the HOSP wanted so badly with a Van Ert trap and we set it.  When we woke up the next morning, the trap was sprung.  Remembering some of the lessons from this List, we looked for clear plastic garbage bags but could only find dry cleaner bags.  (Lesson six: get the clear plastic garbage bags BEFORE you need them).  We covered the nestbox with the laundry bag and opened the box: out flew the very angry male rogue HOSP into our bag.  He vigorously fought his way out of the laundry bag (the plastic is wimpy) and flew away.  We were absolutely dumbfounded at his ability to peck so fast (I think they have hooked bills?) and were caught off-guard by this.  (Lesson seven:  HOSP didn't get where they are, population wise, by being shrinking violets!  BE PREPARED to face an amazingly aggressive bird when you catch one).

Even though the nestbox is still empty, and the Van Ert back in place, set, and I've put grass hanging out of the hole to entice him, the HOSP will have none of it and is apparently hanging around, harrassing the bluebirds in my yard (nine day old nestlings) and bothering the birds in a nearby yard.

The rehabber took the four nuthatch babies back from me the next day and has reported that they are doing very well.  The nuthatch parents have been heard but not seen around their old nestbox, and haven't entered it (or else we would have "caught" them).  The rehabber has weighed the baby nuthatches (the smallest is now 18.5 grams and the largest 22.5 grams) and plans to release them into her flight cage in about two weeks.  Once they are flying and eating to her satisfaction, we plan on  releasing them in my yard when the time comes. (Does anyone think this is a bad idea?)

One other thing that the rehabber told me that I've never seen mentioned on this List (I joined about a year ago) is that one of the biggest predators of baby birds is CHIPMUNKS!  I was floored when she told me this.  She's seen this with her own eyes in nests she has in her yard.  She also told me that a chipmunk tunneled its way into her flight cage and was able to kill a grown male cardinal (the chipmunk ate only its head).  The cardinal was able to fly by that point; apparently the chipmunk wore it out and then caught it.  (This became Lesson eight for me).

Currently, this is what I'm left with: an empty Peterson box ten feet away from the original NABS box, which is also empty but has a set Van Ert in it.  The bluebirds are nesting in another NABS box about 70 feet away from both of them.  The HOSP is still around.  This HOSP is the first I've ever seen in my yard and there is still no sign of a female HOSP around.

I welcome your thoughts and comments!  One thing I'd like to think is that this HOSP will have been a teacher to a few others, as well, so that perhaps what happened in my yard won't be repeated in any other's!

Donna in Marlborough, CT

From: Phil Berry, mrtony8"at"mchsi.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 12:32 PM
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: English Sparrow As Food: DO NOT READ UNLESS YOU WANT TO EAT THEM!!

Following taken from "The English Sparrow As A Pest" by Ned Dearborn, Assistant Biologist. Farmer's Bulletin #493, US Dept of Agriculture, April 20, 1912. I have seen many requests on the list over the years for a good recipe for HOSP.....you may thank (or curse) Keith Kridler for this one. He sent it to me a few years ago. English Sparrow as Food .........There is no reason why the birds should not be utilized for food in this country, as they have been in the Old World for centuries. Thier flesh is palatable, and though their bodies are small, their numbers fully compensate for  their lack of size. Birds that have been trapped may be kept alive in large outdoor cages, sheltered from storms and cold winds, until they are wanted for the table. It is unprofitable  to keep them long, however, as the quantity of grain or other food they require daily amounts to more than half their own weight. A variety of food is necessary to keep them in good condition. Bread, oats, wheat, bran, and corn meal mash, lettuce, cabbage, and tender shoots of sprouting grain are some of the things they relish. A supply of clean water is essential. I won' t go into detail on how we get these birds ready to cook, but you get the idea. They won't go willingly into the oven. (Phil) Sparrows may be cooked by any of the methods employed for reedbirds or quail. When boned, broiled, buttered, and served on toast they are particularly good  and compare favorably with the best kinds of small game..................

From: Afinechef"at"aol.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 7:40 PM
Subject: Re: HOSP traps

Hi Debi, One thing (among many) that Keith Kridler has taught those of us on the List-serve is to scatter feathers around the nestbox that you are using to catch HOSP.  It seems that the male's urge to use the feathers in a nest will usually overcome his reticence to enter a box he suspects has a trap. Any feathers will do, (just not really huge ones--has to fit through the hole).
Good luck and good trapping, Donna in Marlborough, CT

...I sometimes will let them start nesting because it just is easier than trying to fight it - but then abort the nesting and get the HOSP at night and in morning like I suggest. ...You can also try moving the trap boxes around. Sometimes they think it is a new box and then go in. Also you can try sticky back mouse paper. You MUST absolutely watch the box every single second - but put the sticky back paper on the floor of the nest box and they might not notice it like the trap - thus they get themselves in the box and can't get out. It is a nasty measure but it works. You can also try places some long dried grass in the hole - hanging out of the hole. Some HOSP will see that and wonder "who is messing with my nest box" and they'll go in the nestbox to check it out. KK uses feathers - spread those around the base of the box. He claims the HOSP go nuts and just want to take them right into the nest box. That hasn't worked for me. Some of these HOSP are just entirely too smart and these are the ones I just let start the nesting process and abort mid-stream or else use my gun. .... :-)

From: Bet Zimmerman, ezdz"at"charter.net
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 8:28 PM
Subject: RE: To :( or not to :(

The fairly new Bluebird Nut Cafe Forum at http://pub177.ezboard.com/bbluebirdnutcafe  allows discussions of active HOSP control techniques. Bet from CT

From: Maynard R Sumner [mailto:m-r-sumner"at"juno.com] Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 8:16 AM To: bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu Subject: Cage trap Hi All, I need some more of the traps that go into the nestbox that has a cage on it. The one that you trap the sparrow and take the whole thing out and the sparrow is in cage. With this kind the sparrows do not it away as much. I lost my old order form for this one. Thank you, Maynard Sumner Flint, MI -

From: jwick"at"tds.net
Sent: Sunday, April 04, 2004 9:57 AM
Subject: Re: Cage trap

Here you are Maynard: Dave Magness at Jennabird would be the guy to contact. Click on this weblink and then the sparrow traps photo found on the Jennabird Homepage: http://www.jennabird.com/ Dave may also be reached at: For product related questions or phone orders please us the following contact information: Jenna Bird Silverside Road Suite 203 Wilmington, DE 19810 Phone: (800) 780-9986 Fax: (866 )250-6065

From: Dottie Roseboom, rosedot"at"mtco.com
Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 11:44 AM
Subject: Re: HOSP blues

Everyone, I hope that everyone can take John's warning about HOSP & nest removal seriously. Many of us have had similar misfortunes.  I follow Keith's advice with a slight modification - the HOSP around here are very suspicious.  They usually check the nestbox before entering - even if the nest has been built.  So I leave their nest in the box, set the trap, and use bits of another nest, feathers, or plastic on the ground.  They can't seem to resist adding 1 more item to the nest.  When they check the nestbox, they see their nest, & hopefully, the trap has blended into it.   I quickly dispatch the trapped sparrow. If the nest is more than half-built, and I set the trap & catch the male  and re-set the trap BEFORE the female notices that the male has disappeared, I will sometimes also trap her.   If she hasn't been caught within 2 hours, she has abandoned the nestbox, and I then clean out all signs of HOSP. Some people prefer to leave the nest, sterilize the eggs, and allow the HOSP to continue using this nestbox.  That would probably prevent the HOSP from preying upon surrounding cavity nesters.  However, this ties up a nest box for several weeks and the adults would then be free to reproduce somewhere else this season.
      Dottie Roseboom
      Peoria    IL    (central)

From: Kerry Sweet [mailto:ksweet3450"at"yahoo.com]
Sent: Monday, April 05, 2004 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: HOSP blues John & All,

This is true for me also, We once unknowingly destroyed a house sparrow(HOSP) nest that was built in the boat trailer when we hooked up the boat and went to the lake, the male HOSP in return went to a near by nestbox with Eastern Bluebird(EABL) eggs and removed and broke all of them, it was like revenge or something. I have been very cautious ever since to eliminate the male HOSP first before destroying his eggs. Kerry in NE corner of Okla.

From: mrtony8"at"mchsi.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 11:55 AM
Subject: HOSP Trapping

Click the link or copy and paste into your browser to see what professional "bird trappers" say about catching HOSP. I do not recommend reading the entire website. ...

so the link won't work. Go to www.birdbarrier.com, click on ID your bird link, then HOSP link, then to Sparrow trap link. Some info for those who are into ground trapping. I have been, but my &^%$#"at" ground trap lets them out every time. I won't mention who made it because I think the person monitors this list. Phil Berry Gulf Breeze, Florida

From: Kerry Sweet, ksweet3450"at"yahoo.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 9:32 PM
Subject: house sparrow question

Hi All,

Say you have a house sparrow(HOSP) and he's got a female and they got a good nest going in a nestbox and then I catch the HOSP with the inhouse trap and he is in the nestbox good and trapped can't get out.

Then I go and try to get him out and he ACCIDENTALLY gets away flying off leaving me stomping and cursing.

Here is the question: What are the odds of him going back to THAT box? My thinking is that he wouldn't go back to that box due to the bad experience he had of being trapped.

This is the same thing I think when a Bluebird gets trapped in a box that he won't go back.

I guess unless the bird is band you can't tell if it is the same bird or not. Has anyone had any experience with this sort of thing?

Kerry in NE corner of Okla.

From: John Schuster, mailto:wildwingco"at"earthlink.net
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 10:03 PM
Subject: Re: house sparrow question

Dear Kerry,

If that HOSP gets away from you, you've just educated a killer, that may enter an adjacent nest box and will kill or drive away the birds that are trying to nest there. The male HOSP can be very vengeful when things do not go their way, and that's why I recommend that you trap early and often before a HOSP challenge manifests itself on your trail.

If you think you can not handle a trapped HOSP in a box trap, then take the entire trap down and place the trap inside a large clear plastic bag before you open the trap. That way if the HOSP gets away from you at least the HOSP can not get out of the bag.

I believe an once of cure is worth a ton of headaches later.

Cheers and as always...
Happy Bluebird Trails To You,

John Schuster

From: Brucemac1"at"aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 10:09 PM
Subject: Re: house sparrow question

In a Message dated 4/6/2004 9:35:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ksweet3450"at"yahoo.com writes:

Hello Kerry,

I'm betting that he'll be back.

I don't think that there's a bluebirder out there that hasn't experienced the same HOSP escape..!!

I use a large plastic sheet to throw over the box, or place the trap containing the HOSP in a clear plastic bag. Then you can see what's going on, grab him (or her) and dispose.

Bruce Macdonald, SW Ontario

From: Maynard R Sumner [ mailto:m-r-sumner"at"juno.com ]

Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 10:29 PM

To: bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu

Subject: Re: house sparrow question

I have traped male hosp and had him accidentally get out.

He went up in a tree. I went back into my house and saw him

go from the tree to the box. The thing is he did not know I had

set the trap again. This time time he did not get away.

I have accidentally traped Bluebirds and they go back into the box.

All locations are not the same and all birds are not the same. Do whatever works for you.

Maynard Sumner

Flint, MI

From: Afinechef"at"aol.com [mailto:Afinechef"at"aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 11:15 PM
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: re: House Sparrow Question

Hi All, Donna in Marlborough, CT I would like to add my 2 cents to John's post: <If you think you can not handle a trapped HOSP in a box trap, then take
the entire trap down and place the trap inside a large clear plastic
bag before you open the trap.  That way if the HOSP gets away from you
at least the HOSP can not get out of the bag.>
Everyone, get STRONG clear plastic garbage bags-- do NOT use dry cleaning bags !  HOSP have hooked beaks and when frightened will fight like the Dickens to get out.  I lost a trapped rogue male HOSP this way two years ago and want to keep reminding the List that the time to buy the strong clear plastic garbage bags is BEFORE you have the HOSP in hand! When the HOSP got away from me two years ago, he did start to rampage in the occupied nestboxes around my house. Folks on the List at that time advised me to put some feathers and pieces of nest around the nestbox he was favoring (he'd killed several white-breasted nuthatch babies and injured the rest, so I'd taken them to a rehabber and removed the nuthatch nest so the HOSP wouldn't kill the parents, too). Good luck! Donna in Marlborough, CT

From: Dottie Roseboom [mailto:rosedot"at"mtco.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 2004 11:59 PM
To: Afinechef"at"aol.com; BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: House Sparrow Question

Here's a trick that I learned a long time ago.  I have nestboxes that open from the top (hinged) , as well as the side.  When I need to trap a HOSP, I remove the screws holding down the roof, place the trap inside, and omit replacing the screws.  When the sparrow is trapped, the hole will be blocked, and I just slowly reach inside through the TOP, not the side.  When an object approaches from the top, HOSP will usually cower to the floor.  Very fast & efficient.  Haven't "lost" a sparrow since doing it this way.  Once you grab the sparrow, hold firmly, but not tight. They will not struggle. Don't be timid, or they'll out-psyche you.   
      Dottie Roseboom
      Peoria    IL    (central)

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2004 10:02 AM To: ksweet3450"at"yahoo.com; BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu Subject: Re: HOSP Question :( Kerry, This has happened to all of us, I'm sure. Every year I get better and better at fewer escapes, but sometimes one gets away. Yes, I have had them come right back again. I am guessing it is the same bird because I have caught them after immediately resetting trap. They get awfully committed to the box sometimes. And, yes, I some HOSP would not return after having the bejeebers scared out of them with that narrow escape. I'd leave top portion of nest in box and reset the trap and see if he comes back. In this situation, I generally check trap once every hour (if possible). If house is on a trail, set trap late in evening and then recheck next morning early. If no takers, I then remove trap and all nesting material as he has probably abandoned box. To minimize HOSP escape when opening up the box after trap is sprung, someone posted an excellent suggestion a few days ago. A mesh laundry bag with drawstring could be placed over box and cinched tight against pole. Then open box and HOSP will fly into bag. Get him in a corner and hold that part tightly as you remove remaining bag from pole and take care of the problem. I love the mesh laundry bag suggestion because you can easily see what you have and it should eliminate all chance of escape. I have had a bit of practice and prefer to reach in and grab them with my bare hands. The reason I personally prefer this is it is easier and sometimes they hunker down and play 'possum, refusing to fly out into the bag. There is a method though. Leave trap sprung shut. Open box just a crack and block all chance of exit on left side of box with your hand while taking your other hand and carefully slipping it in to grab him. You are only opening up box finger width so there is no opening for him to escape. This works very well if you are very careful to limit the opening so it is not big enough for him to sneak out. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2004 10:26 AM To: Dottie Roseboom; BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu Subject: Re: House Sparrow Question Dottie, Had to laugh when I read about the way you catch yours because it reminded me of one of my great escapes. I have a nestbox in back (chalet type) that I bought at Wild Birds Unlimited years ago. It is a sturdy, thick, nice box and has access from side or top. The top is hinged in the middle though so lifts fairly easily if not latched. One day I set my trap because a HOSP had "taken" the box. I forgot to hinge the top shut. Trap worked fine, but as I approached the box, guess who flew out the top? Super Sparrow. He must have hit it just right and with some force because it flew open and he flew out. That roof is 1" thick! I just have a strange box. Your method sounds good to me. Just thought I'd share that one. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Andy Oster [mailto:akaoster"at"msn.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2004 2:38 PM
To: BLUEBIRD-L
Subject: previous e-mail about possible Sparrows taking over nest box

Good news everyone my Blues are back, names- Pebbles & Bam Bam, they left for a couple of days or so I think. They are well and in and out if the nest box, I checked it and it looks like no sparrows have tried to build over the nest. Although I do get nervous about a couple of the sparrows flying around, Bam Bam fights them off. It looks as though Pebbles maybe starting to lay eggs soon. What kind of trap should I put on the blue bird nest box for sparrows, just in case.????? Thanks Andy Oster

From: Snoopy [mailto:snoopy"at"wmis.net] Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2004 5:34 PM To: bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu Subject: WARNING HOSP trapping Post ************WARNING HOSP TRAPPING POST*********************** My beautiful blues built a very nice nest last week only to have mean ol' mr. hosp come in and build his nasty ol' mess on top of it. I didn't find any blues dead, so I think they just gave up the fight and left. (and thankfully before any eggs were laid.) Well yesterday afternoon I went out to get my mail, and there was that trap I ordered from Mr. Van Ert... (thanks again to whoever showed me that website) Well today, since I had a little time to watch, I put it on the nest box and it wasn't 30 minutes later, and I had caught the nasty rat finch hosp and I won't tell you what I did with him, but it WASN'T very nice. I also want to thank everyone who told about putting a clear plastic bag over the box when you open it to get them out, if I hadn't done it, the nasty bugger would have surely gotten away from me. Hopefully he's the only one (though I doubt it) that comes around these parts this year. I hope my blues come back now, that was their favourite box. Joy in Michigan -----Original Message----- From: Debi Money [mailto:dmoney"at"getatlas.com] Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2004 10:58 PM To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu Subject: RE: HOSP's Dear List, Believe me I am taking everything you are telling me to heart. I have my mesh laundry bag and my Gilbertson PVC house should be here any day. I am keeping a close watch on the boxes. When I'm not at work, anyway. I'll let you all know what happens! Thanks and happy BlueBirding! Joy in Birding! debi money Spfld. MO 65802

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 12:04 PM
Subject: Re: WARNING HOSP Trapping Post

Joy, So glad you got him. I would remove the HOSP material from the top of the nest and leave the EABL nest in hopes they return. Last year, my neighbor had EABL start a nest in her box and then Mr. HOWR showed up and stuffed it full of sticks, chasing the EABL off. We left the HOWR nest there for several weeks, but he must have chosen another site and the EABL returned, frantically checking out her box. I figured the HOWR nest must he a dummy nest due to the time it had been there without completion, so we took out the dummy nest, leaving the original EABL start. They finished their nest within 2 days and raised a successful clutch. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Kate Arnold [mailto:bbnestbox"at"1starnet.com]
Sent: Friday, April 09, 2004 3:14 PM
Re: previous e-mail about possible

Sparrows taking over nest box Please forgive me if I have misunderstood your question. With the mixture of experts and beginners on this list it is sometimes hard to tell what is needed. The sparrow traps we talk about are live traps that go inside the nestbox, but just because they are called "sparrow traps" doesn't mean they will only catch or discourage house sparrows. I don't set a trap unless the house sparrow is actively using the nestbox, otherwise all you will do is catch your bluebirds, and possibly cause them to abandon the nestbox. I do not recall if you have another nestbox nearby. If not, you can put one up and very possibly the house sparrows will take an interest in the new nestbox, where you can trap them there. Kate Arnold Paris, TX

The male is better – it takes about a week or two before another males will take his place. It takes about 100 male chirps before another female arrives. J

From: Bet Zimmerman [mailto:ezdz"at"charter.net]
Sent: Saturday, April 17, 2004 10:17 AM
Subject: RE: So what do I do now? - NOTE: passive and active control methods discussed.

1.  Put up a sparrow spooker as soon as the first egg is laid.  See http://www.sialis.org/sparrowspooker.htm for instructions.  Close to 100% effective in protecting eggs and nestlings from HOSP.  Remove after fledging. 2.  Get or make a magic halo for your bird feeder.   http://www.sialis.org/halo.htm  .  90%+ effective in keeping house sparrows (HOSP) out of bird feeders.  You will, as a result, see more native birds at the feeders (the HOSP usually crowd the more timid birds out.) 3.  Get a spare box and an inbox trap.  Van-Ert is one of the best.  Use it to trap sparrows that attempt to nest in the spare box.  (see http://www.sialis.org/hosp.htm for more info on all methods of house sparrows control, both passive and active.) I don't think it's "inevitable" that HOSP will attack bluebirds - depends on the birds and the situations.  However, generally by nature they are extremely aggressive.  Even if they don't attack, I have seen them harrass birds for days on end (tree swallows) so they are unable to feed the nestlings, which then starve to death.  I believe the saying "It is better to have no nestbox at all than to allow house sparrows to reproduce in one."  With some untested theoretical calculations, I figured 1 pair of hosp could hypothetically multiply into 1250 birds in a 5 year period (see http://www.sialis.org/hospnumbers.htm ) After three years of using a combination of passive and active control methods, I'm seeing a dramatic reduction in the number of HOSP in my area, AND a significant increase in diversity of other birds and successful nestings by native cavity nesters such as bluebirds, tree swallows, titmice and chickadees (before I would lose a whole nesting season trying to keep HOSP out of boxes--they kept them unavailable). Since HOSP really don't migrate, you can control them in your immediate area.  If I did not use HOSP management methods, I expect nearly 100% of my boxes would have HOSP breeding in them. Bet from CT

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 10:30 AM
Subject: HOSP and EUST capture :(

I just wanted to thank whoever recommended the mesh laundry bag with drawstring closure idea. It seems a genuinely foolproof method to capturing HOSP or EUST once a trap has been sprung in a nestbox. (Even I) have had a couple HOSP escape from me this spring while reaching in to grap them. I am dealing with a number of different style boxes and helping people who "just don't have the heart". I have a new PUMA setup at our island house at Put-in-Bay and used the bag to capture a EUST that had entered a "starling resistant entry hole" gourd - bird found its way in, but was a little confused on how to exit so I lowered housing and stuck my coat in the hole. The laundry bag works wonderfully and there is no chance of bird escaping when I have the bag cinched tight against the pole and open up the box. The other great thing about it is you can easily see what you have and if the bird decides to "play 'possum" you can reach in there with the bag over box and wake him up. So thank you for all the good ideas. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Snoopy [mailto:snoopy"at"wmis.net]
Sent: Monday, April 19, 2004 1:46 PM
Re: HOSP and EUST capture :(

"if the bird decides to "play 'possum" you can reach in there with the bag over box and wake him up. " This is how the 2 HOSP I have caught have both been. I have the Van Ert trap and each time I got a sparrow he tried to hide in there amongst his messy nest thinking I wouldn't see him. I had to reach in with my hand and and force him out into my bag. I caught Mr. Bluebird one time, also, and so of course I didn't put the bag over the box (I love the van ert trap because you can still see through the sides of the hole cover which bird you have captured- and when you see that flash of blue there is no mistaking him for a HOSP) and he didn't try to hide at all, he just flew out as soon as I open the door. Also for those who are worried that if you catch a bluebird in there that it won't ever come back... it will!!! I was so scared he wouldn't come back after I caught him, but they were both back (the Mr. and the Mrs.) that same evening!! Joy in Michigan

From: Pamela Ford [mailto:jpford"at"comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 12:09 PM
Subject: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

I’ve never experienced this situation before. Maybe the HOSP in my area spread the word that if they nest in those boxes they get trapped! I have a HOSP pair building a nest in my front yard juniper right at the corner of the garage. How do I deal with this. Should I leave them alone and addle the eggs, thereby keeping them occupied? I’m reluctant to cause them to head to my backyard boxes that are due to hatch EABL tomorrow.Any ideas?

Pam in Harford County, Maryland

From: Phil Berry [mailto:mrtony8"at"mchsi.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 1:40 PM
Subject: Re: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

Be certain it is HOSP. I would bet against it. If not HOSP, you can not legally touch it.

Phil Berry

From: Pamela Ford [mailto:jpford"at"comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 6:29 PM
Subject: RE: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

Definitely HOSP. Black bib and all. And incezzznt male HOSP call! So far it is just the start of a nest up at about the 6 foot level. I’ll let them go for now and keep an eye out for the eggs. I usually have chipping sparrows or house finches nest in this tree, although they are not usually successful. Seems the starlings let the babies get to about 4 days old and then eat them! Maybe this would happen to the HOSP too!

Pam

From: Dottie Roseboom [mailto:rosedot"at"mtco.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 7:01 PM
To: jpford"at"comcast.net; 'Phil Berry'; Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

Yeah, my mother-in-law always has a nest or two of HOSP in a huge juniper that butts up against the junction of her porch & house. The first year that my husband told me that he would do away with them when his mother went into the house - I said no - that they probably weren't HOSP - but sure enough, just about that time, the male started protecting his territory.

Sometimes, these sparrows do fledge (hard to be there at the right time to dispose of things, and I don't want a HOSP upset about losing a nest). We try to dispose the fledglings as they get ready to leave the nest. If my mother-in-law would only allow me to addle the eggs!

Dottie Roseboom
Peoria IL (central)

From: Pamela Ford [mailto:jpford"at"comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 12:09 PM
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

I've never experienced this situation before.  Maybe the HOSP in my area spread the word that if they nest in those boxes they get trapped!  I have a HOSP pair building a nest in my front yard juniper right at the corner of the garage.  How do I deal with this.  Should I leave them alone and addle the eggs, thereby keeping them occupied?  I'm reluctant to cause them to head to my backyard boxes that are due to hatch EABL tomorrow.Any ideas?

Pam in Harford County, Maryland

Pam, I'm so glad you posted this. I will be re-checking my evergreens! I've often had chipping sparrows nesting there, but  they are always welcome. I would hate to see them displaced too! The local HOSP might suspect now that my decoy box must be haunted LOL, and they are CHIRPing near tree cavities. I'm going to try my ground trap baited with white feathers to get the ones defending the tree cavity.

Definitely addle the eggs if you can't trap them.

Barbara Burnham

From: Bet Zimmerman [mailto:ezdz"at"charter.net]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 1:34 PM
Subject: RE: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

I think I would go with a pinhole (in the large end of the egg) instead of addling - I'm not sure how well addling would work if the eggs were partly/nearly developed. From http://www.sialis.org/hosp.htm :  While they prefer to nest in cavities such as a nestbox, they will nest in rafters, gutters, roofs, ledges, eaves, soffits and attic vents, dryer vents, holes in wood siding, behind shake siding, loading docks, roof supports, commercial signs, behind or above pipes and ductwork on buildings, wall voids, evergreens and shrubs, nests of cliff swallows and northern orioles, and even alongside osprey nests. Unlike bluebirds or tree swallows, they will nest in close proximity to others of their species. Bet from CT

From: Ylana Moye [mailto:ylanamoye"at"junct.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 4:15 PM
Subject: RE: HOSP nesting in an evergreen

For us newbies please explain what "addling" means. Lana

From: Pamela Ford [mailto:jpford"at"comcast.net]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 4:19 PM
Subject: Definition of "addling"

Addling is technically the process of destroying the embryo in the shell by shaking the egg vigorously.  Sometimes I think the term is also used to describe other ways of rendering an egg unviable without destroying the shell, for example, by coating the egg with vegetable oil.

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 4:49 PM
Re: HOSP nesting in an evergreen :(

Pam, We have seen some HOSP nesting as you describe. Our neighbor has a pine tree that harbored a nest last year and my friend had a nest in a juniper bush. My friend discovered the nest after the babies hatched. She killed all except one female. That one kept them busy. They did not harm her EABL. If you can catch them when there are eggs in nest, you might want to prick eggs with a pin or you can take half the clutch and refrigerate it for 24 hours (makes eggs nonviable). The HOSP will remain to care for viable eggs during this procedure. Now remove the remaining HOSP eggs and replace with the refrigerated ones. You can warm them a little in your hand if you are worried about Mom realizing what happened. You can then refrigerate the remaining eggs and replace or just toss them I imagine - she should be happy to care for whatever is there. I used this procedure one season on my trail. (I had a little container of HOSP eggs in my refrigerator.) I have boxes paired very close - 5-10 feet. I never had a HOSP bother another bird as result of this. They just sat happily on the eggs for 2 or 3 weeks until they realized something just wasn't right. Then they abandoned the nest. I no longer do it with my boxes because it is a box unavailable for native nesters and I hate to have the HOSP so close to another nesting bird, but I think this would be wonderful strategy for HOSP nests in evergreens (if you can reach the nest). Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Snoopy To: bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu
Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 8:06 AM
Subject: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

Sparrow spooker is still working great here.... my blues are safe and sound. =) Tree Swallows have recovered from their fight with the HOSP (where one TRES was killed) and are rebuilding in a new box. I don't know who exactly the nest is for though, lol, there are about 8 TRES flying around wildly, I love watching them. I hope some of the others will build in one of my many empty boxes. I had a horrible, rotten experience with the HOSP yesterday, and I am still pounding my head over it... I was going out to put the Van Ert trap in a nest box where HOSP have built their mess. I only use the trap when I can watch the box closely, as I don't want to have a bluebird or swallow trapped in there for a long time. Well I didn't "knock" on the box as I usually do, (why?? ) before opening it, and when I opened it, there was a female HOSP inside that flew out, basically into my face. If I had known she was there, and had my mesh bag with me, I could have trapped her without even using the trap! As it was, I think the whole mess warned her, that I was there to "get" her, because neither one of them went back into the house for the rest of the day. No catches for me yesterday. There is nothing as IRRITATING as 2 male HOSP, each one sitting on a different nest box (2 boxes that are paired about 15 feet apart) singing their hearts out to attract a female. UGH. I was supposed to "sleep in" today and that was the noise that woke me up. Joy in Michigan From: Dottie Roseboom [mailto:rosedot"at"mtco.com] Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 10:08 PM To: Bluebird Cornell Subject: Re: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK Joy, Yep, I think the "sparrow in the box" has happened to most of us. Now, whenever I plan on placing a VanErt trap, I always block the entrance with 1 hand, and ease the other hand into the box, feeling around for that HOSP. Once in a while, I'll grab him without having to set the trap. Great time to set the trap and then catch the female. I often wonder what I'd do, if the nestbox had a snake in it! ...

From: Pamela Ford [mailto:jpford"at"comcast.net]
Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 11:13 AM
Subject: two at a time HOSP trapping

A male HOSP entered the nest box with the Gilbertson universal trap this morning and was promptly trapped.  I saw him enter and went to the kitchen to get a plastic bag.  By the time I returned, I saw the female at the entrance hole.  She didn't move as I approached the box and I saw why.  She had poked her head into the hole to see what had happened to the male and got her head stuck between the edge of the hole and the trap mechanism!  I just grabbed her from behind and wiggled her head out of the hole before dealing with the male in the box.  Too bad every trap isn't this efficient!

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 10:00 AM
Re: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

Dottie et al, Here's a little procedural trick you might want to use. Before going to the box, head for the laundry room and grab one of those socks that lost his parner. I know you all have a small collection of these. A small rag does nicely too. Stick the sock in the hole before opening the box instead of your hand. I'm all for recycling - dead HOSP or EUST for injured raptors AND partnerless socks for HOSP trappin'. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: BluebirdNut.com [mailto:bluebirdnut"at"a-znet.com]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 10:12 AM
Re: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

As a side point, does anyone know if raptor centers will accept "live" prey? Would be an alternative for those who have trouble with doing the finalizing themselves .....

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 10:43 AM
Re: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

I know the answer to this one. They will NOT accept "live" prey. I have spoken to officials at our local wildlife center and another one in northern Ohio. If they receive a live bird, they are often duty bound (due to rules they operate under) to rehabilitate and release the animal, regardless of whether it is native or not. Also releasing a live HOSP into the raptor flight cage for the raptors who are near reenty into the wild is not feasible either. The flight cages have openings large enough for the HOSP to escape. They greatly appreciate the killed frozen HOSP and EUST that are humanely killed. Emphasis put on humane kill - as quick as possible - no chemicals or pellets or BB's. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Phil Berry [mailto:mrtony8"at"mchsi.com]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 12:03 PM
Re: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

well, i guess they must be eating HOSP here, then, because mine are always accepted when i take them in. or they do it to humor me, then turn them loose after i leave? Phil Berry

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 1:19 PM
Re: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

Phil et al, It may very well depend on their rules of operation. Our local wildlife rehab center told me that their rules do not clarify native vs. non native for rehabilitation. They cannot harm an animal. Also, your rehabber might have a flight cage that would permit raptors to hunt them without the HOSP escaping. It may very well differ from one rehabber to another, so I guess I must apologize because this is the policy for a couple that I know of. I guess the wisest course of action would be to call the facility before bringing the HOSP to them and make sure you bring them the food in the way they prefer. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Kenny Kleinpeter [mailto:kpkmajk"at"cox.net]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 1:40 PM
RE: HOSP! UGH! WARNING: TRAPPING TALK

Our state rehab association president spoke at out last bluebird meeting and said that they treat all animals the same. But, the key is that some rehabbers in our state specifically state that they do not accept sparrows and starlings (rehabbers after my heart). Bottom line: each rehabber makes her/his own rules. Kenny Kleinpeter Baton Rouge, LA

From: Kellams, Dina M [mailto:dmkellam"at"indiana.edu]
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 4:26 PM
Subject: HOSP in S. Indiana

Hi all - I've just signed back on for the year and thought I would give a report of how things are going in Lawrence Co., Ind. This is my third year of monitoring a nestbox in my yard and as last year I had TRES take over the box after just one EABL brood, I decided to try pairing.  The Blues and Swallows have been all over my neighborhood and I was sooo excited.  But it has turned out to be a very bad year for HOSP.  I live in a rural neighborhood and my first year I had no problems with HOSP.  They came around a bit, but through some passive control, they went away and I had 3 successful EABL broods.  Last year I was forced to buy a trap after my passive control wasn't working and I caught and disposed of 1 HOSP.  This year I am up to 7(!) and Friday and I was devastated to find a TRES that had been pecked to death in the box (she was working on a nest).  My blues have just finished laying eggs and after I trapped #s 6 & 7 a new pair of TRES began working on a nest in my 2nd box.  But I have already seen another male HOSP checking out the box with my blues.  My neighborhood has grown in the past few years and my neighbors have put up nestboxes and Purple Martin houses and I fear they are just not monitoring them, which I attribute to the HOSP problem.  Or, have others in the area had a greater than usual HOSP problem? Worried in S. Indiana, Dina

From: Burnham, Barbara
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 8:49 AM
Subject: RE: HOSPs everywhere

Mike,

I have also been using a decoy box on the other side of my yard, and it is working very well to draw the house sparrows away from the bluebirds. The decoy box is far enough away from the bluebird nestbox that the blues don't have to spend a lot of time "defending" the decoy box from the HOSP. A round 1.25" entrance adapter ensures that no bluebirds will enter and be trapped. Works great during nesting season. I let the HOSP claim it, and when they have put in a few straws, set the trap after dark. It's working so well, I think I'll leave it even in winter for the HOSP to "roost" in.

Barbara Burnham

Ellicott City, MD

From: Paula
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: Re: HOSP everywhere

Kieran,

Another suggestion (if school has a policy against active control), would be to replace HOSP eggs with plastic craft eggs that look like the real thing or refrigerate the real thing for 24 hours (makes them nonviable) and replace or pin prick through shell (nonviable) and replace. I tried the refrigeration method on some of my nests one year to experiment (had a whole container of HOSP eggs in the fridge to place in nests as needed) and found that they would sit on these eggs for up to 30 days. This keeps them busy and not breeding. They also were not aggressive to adjacent native nesters with this method. By merely ripping out the nests and throwing out the eggs, you may be encouraging them to reproduce in safer location that is still close to your trail. Their young may then return the next year to your boxes to cause more HOSP problems. Also with the nest & egg destruction (which I've tried too), I have had several immediate HOSP "retaliations" on adjacent native nesters where they have destroyed the eggs of the other bird.

Paula Z

Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Dottie Roseboom [mailto:rosedot"at"mtco.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 1:00 PM
Subject: Re: HOSP everywhere

Kieran, If there really is NO other way to control the house sparrows, Paula's suggestion will reduce the number of offspring for this year. And it's also better to allow the HOSP to nest, than to destroy the nest & for them to possibly invade other nests.   (I have witnessed this personally!) However, IMHO, it would be better to develop a way to dispatch these sparrows, as the general public will see sparrows using nestboxes placed by humans and interpret this as "houses for sparrows".  They would not know that the eggs are sterile and you are doing this to prevent the sparrows from attacking other nests. They might even join your effort and buy sparrowhouses & millet at their local Wal-Mart.  And sparrows not caught this year, will still be causing problems next year.   Good luck with developing an over-all strategy for this area.
    Dottie Roseboom
    Peoria    IL    (central)

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 9:39 AM
Re: HOSP Everywhere :(

Kieran et al, I find aggressive control is still very possible at site frequented by people. During a nestbox check on your trail, you can make note of which boxes have HOSP. I leave everything undisturbed at this point, but usually leave screws to boxes backed out for easy access later in the day. Now return at dusk or at night, approaching house quietly from rear. Block hole with small rag or (partnerless) sock. Open just a crack while blocking all exit with other hand. Reach in and grab him/her. If it was a female, I set my Van Ert inbox trap (no one can see it externally) and check again at about hour after sunup to get the male. Now everything (trap and nest material) comes out of the box and it is truly ready for another bird. If it is another HOSP, so be it. This is my third year monitoring my trail as well, and I am noticing a dramatic decrease in HOSP using nestboxes on my trail, but especially at home where I can be even more vigilant :) On the trail, the trend is clear. My trail is at a local park - wide open mowed lawns with a few trees and farm pond. There are only two homes relatively close to this trail. The boxes near the one house get some HOSP activity, but not much. I do not think this house has any nestboxes on its property. The boxes near the other home get quite a bit of HOSP activity because the owner of this house is (unwittingly?) breeding HOSP. He has a 12-compartment House Sparrow Hotel (my term for unmonitored PUMA housing), numerous nestboxes and a new kestrel box (complete with resident EUST). I have trapped and removed 4 male HOSP from the box closest to this house so far this season. There have been no other HOSP problems at the remaining 20 boxes on the trail. Another trick I use is to start my monitoring at the nestboxes that I know may have a HOSP problem. My boxes are also numbered accordingly - this is usually easy to do because you usually park near road where a people house (or school building) is most likely to be (and where your HOSP problems will be). Box #1 on my trail is the box that had the 4 male HOSP this year. If I see HOSP nesting material, I merely set the trap and continue my monitoring. When I loop around back to the car, I almost always have him (takes me about 30 - 45 minutes). At home, the only nestboxes on my street that I am aware of are the ones I help to monitor. At my two boxes at home, I captured 12 HOSP in 2002, 5 HOSP in 2003 and no HOSP so far in 2004. If they catch sight of me at all, even from quite a distance inside my kitchen (they can see me from the window), they fly off. They are getting fewer and harder to capture here at home which is fine with me. They have caused no problems at the nestboxes on my street this year (so far). So, I can say instead of seeing a ton more, I am seeing a ton less. Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Dottie Roseboom [mailto:rosedot"at"mtco.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 12:42 PM
Re: HOSP Everywhere :( Kieran et al,

No, I do not have more sparrows this year! I agree wholeheartedly with Paula's post. In my experience, if house sparrows are not actively controlled, they become more numerous & more aggressive. The larger the sparrow population, the more competition they feel, and the harder they have to fight for nesting & feeding territories. Seven or eight years ago, I had effectively depleted the population in my area. I became lax about trapping, thinking that the 1 or 2 sparrows around weren't a problem. And they weren't, except those 2 became many. And about that time 2 neighbors began feeding them. Now, we are talking serious problems! (nestlings were killed) So, I began another aggressive dispatchment program. These last several years, the sparrows know to stay away! I will never again allow 1 or 2 sparrows around, thinking that they are no problem. When nestboxes are in a public area, I definitely feel that there should be zero tolerance for HOSP! Main reason: we are teaching the public that sparrows are okay!!!! If bluebird lovers do not control house sparrows, why should we expect the uneducated public to rid their nestboxes of sparrows? If we do not lead the way on sparrow control, how will they learn? Having beautiful bluebird or chickadee families on schoolgrounds, in parks, golf courses, etc is a great way for people to realize that these birds are another option to the house sparrow. Kieran, learn what works best for you on dispatching sparrows. For me, dispatching quickly is much easier than messing around with getting a plastic bag or a mesh laundry bag or whatever. My grandmother raised chickens, and I have a friend who raises parakeets. I learned from them, move slowly, then move quickly, hold the bird firmly but not squeezing tightly. Do NOT allow the sparrow to intimidate you. Don't became exasperated or the stress will transfer to the bird. All of my nestboxes open from the top or side. I'm 6'1", large hands, so I just open the top of the nestbox, slowly, lower the hand into the box, blocking any exits with the forearm. The bird usually cowers into a corner. When you touch him, just encircle him, using the fingers to hold him against the palm. If you remain calm, most of the time, the bird doesn't even fight. I can have a bird dead within 30 seconds of approaching the nestbox. Anyone else around would not even realize anything happened. BTW, I've seen my husband sit quietly in a room, maybe for 10 minutes, and then grab a HOSP flying by - just out of thin air! We used to work in an ancient office building that gathered sparrows and he was our "sparrow trap". Maybe he could get a job at Lowe's!

From: Paula [mailto:PaulaZ"at"columbus.rr.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 11:34 PM
Subject: More HOSP Destruction

:( I monitored my trail today. Box #1 is the closest to the House Sparrow Hotel house. Today I captured male HOSP #5 from this box. This box is paired only 5 feet from Box #2. A week ago, I had eliminated a male HOSP and emptied the box. Here is what I found today. There was a dead adult TRES in the box covered with about 4 inches of HOSP nesting material. The TRES was almost headless. It had been pecked to death obviously. The interesting thing is the HOSP could have built his nest in the box that was 5 feet away. He chose to attack the TRES in the box and then, instead of building his nest in the clean empty box 5 feet away, he built his nest on top of the dead TRES. I couldn't get my traps out of my bag quick enough. I caught Mr. HOSP with a Van Ert trap at 3 pm and he became weasel food for a recovering weasel at the Ohio Wildlife Center at 7 pm..... Paula Z Powell (Central) Ohio

From: Simon [ mailto:simon"at"bowecho.com ]
Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 7:12 AM
Subject: HOSP

Well, we are overrun with HOSP this year. My BB houses have HOSP nests in them, and even the TRES have had their houses overtaken.

I have a great repeating trap that I tried last year, but I never caught a single HOSP in it. How do you get the first bird to start the cycle? I have a small trap that fits in the house, maybe I'll try that to catch one, and then put that one in the big repeating trap?

From: Dottie Roseboom [ mailto:rosedot"at"mtco.com ]
Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: HOSP - trapping

Simon,

By all means, use the inhouse trap! When sparrows actually have nests in

EABL nestboxes, they are fairly easy to trap. I place the trap, making sure not to disturb the nest, then I place parts of an old nest, or some feathers on the grass around the nestbox pole. I modified all of my nestboxes to open from the top & side. I use the top to place the Van Ert trap - I think that it disturbs the nest less. When the nest has already been started, 90% of the time, the sparrow is caught within an hour. I've caught many within

5 minutes. Once in a while, trapping may take 4 - 5 hours. But HOSP are

very devoted to their home and seldom abandon it.

Check the trap often! The Van Ert trap has a red dot on it. When sprung, the dot can be seen from a distance. That way, you can keep an eye on the trap without disturbing a watchful sparrow. I can see if most of my traps from the house (spotting scope).

Two reasons to keep an eye on the trap - you might catch another cavitiy-nester besides the sparrow. Be sure to make positive ID before destroying the trapped bird. A 1 1/4" hole reducer can be placed on the nestbox when you set the trap, preventing blues from entering the nestbox. However, chickadees, carolina wrens, and I think titmouses could still enter. Release the natives as soon as possible.

Also, if an eye is kept on the trap, you might catch both adult sparrows. Quickly dispatch the first trapped bird, and reset the trap. Sometimes the female is caught first, and since the male is the troublemaker, be sure to reset the trap for him. Even if I catch the male first, I immediately reset the trap, and often catch the female. Usually, if she's not caught within 2 hours, she has abandoned the nestbox. She bonds more to the male, while the male bonds more with the nestbox.

BTW, when I had more sparrows, I bought enough Van Ert traps to outfit every single nestbox at the same time!!! Thankfully, I never utilized all of them at once, but there were days that I thought that it might happen. Even now, with the lower population, I had several traps placed at the same time this year.

Now, on to the ground trap. Yes, using a trapped sparrow from the nestbox

in the ground trap will help "decoy" other sparrows to the trap. But, I also trap in winter, when the sparrows are not using the nestboxes.

Keith's tips really helped me have a successful ground trap. For a week or

so, place the trap under a shrub or other area where sparrows congregate. I have a huge honeysuckle shrub (which they love) growing close to the road, which provides gravel & water puddles, another sparrow draw. Rig the trap in such a way that the sparrows can come & go, WITHOUT being trapped. I use white bread in small dishes around the trap, and a few pieces inside the trap. (White bread does not attract the native sparrows.) Keith says that this allows the sparrow time to get used to the strange object. I waited 12 days before setting the trapping mechanism. When the trap was set, I caught most of the HOSP (14) that congregated in that area. Took about 4 hours. After dispatching those sparrows, I baited the trap but did not reset it until the next afternoon. When I reset the trap, I caught 7 more sparrows in about 3 hours. Now, I just leave the trap there, and set it, whenever I notice the population building up again. Once again, check the trap often, making sure that there are NO native sparrows being captured. Even with water & food in the trap, it is stressful on the natives. I release the natives immediately. The white bread certainly helps with not catching natives.

With persistence, you can reduce the sparrow population significantly.

Dottie Roseboom

From: Jscott9536"at"aol.com
Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: HOSP

I have been catching HS with the in insert  trap and wire trap when you capture one in eaither trap put it in the wire cage trap and it will attract more sparrows i keep the traped sparrows alive giving water and food so they will get the other house sparrows to come to it Seems the more I trap  and keep alive keeps my traps very busy.   20 HS and 25 Strlings in the last 2months. Still trying for martins. I never had any blues around until I started cleaning up tthe pest birds JIm

Problems with house sparrows on the bluebird trail (Part 9)

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