Nestboxes (Painting/Staining) (Part 1)
In addition to Messages that have appeared in the Bluebird Mailing Lists on
this topic, the following are on the Audubon Society of Omaha website:
Subj: Re: Second nesting period/linseed oil
Date: 6/7/99 10:55:18 PM Central Daylight Time
From: kridler"at"1Starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: kridler"at"1Starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
Linseed oil is sold in two forms. Raw and Boiled. The boiled is the best and
more refined, it will dry several times quicker than raw. It actually will be
better if the new box was installed now and then taken down and coated with the
oil after it has dried out and aged a little. It is a naturally occurring oil
extracted from seeds but seems to take weeks to lose the tackiness. Once
thoroughly dry it should be safe since the only real danger is getting oil on
the birds feathers before it has a chance to dry. It should be applied to
exterior wood every year in the deep south. KK
Subj: apology/painting/heat
Date: 6/24/99 7:31:19 PM Central Daylight Time
From: kridler"at"1Starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: kridler"at"1Starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
Apology: None needed Phil! Most of us don't have time to be on all lists that
interest us. I like to get tidbits from other lists. Many are looking at this
all wrong. This is a perfect opportunity to do some serious research with house
Sparrows. I would like to know what size boxes, entrance holes, height ETC. This
man is using! I do no long term testing with the same sparrows. Mine normally
have to be replaced every three weeks. Please keep me informed about this HS
"trail" privately! We all need to learn all we can about this HS pest. I have
found that the best way to get people to reduce the house sparrows is AFTER they
have lost several of THEIR Bluebirds. I have read quite a few posts from members
on this list who at the beginning of this season could NEVER kill ANY bird.
Everyone needs to come to this at their own pace and deal with their own
conscience!
Painting:For those who have to buy wood and pay someone else to build the box
you should of course paint the boxes every 2 or 3 years to add years of life.
House paint is safe once dry (27 days) whether latex or oil. Many companies are
using soy bean and fish oil instead of petro chemical mixes in oil based house
paints. All companies are making lines of paint for baby cribs, toys, high
chairs ETC. All of these are tested and safe and would be ok as a dip for the
entire box. I prefer to paint or dip box parts before they are nailed together.
I do not paint my trail boxes since they tend to disappear if they are too
pretty. remember a dark brown box will be 10*F warmer than the same box natural
wood color or light colored paint! I prefer a light gray with a touch of green
to make the box disappear on the trail.
Heat: Yes adding a second top above the box does work to lower temperature
inside the box. Others sometimes add any type of shade for the box. Where ever
temperatures reach 100*F you should have the box so it is in total shade by mid
morning! East sides of utility poles, mounted on poles at the east edge of large
trees, east sides of tall buildings ETC. (Linda's and Dick's California method
of tree branch hanging boxes will help) Stick a high/low thermometer in your
nestboxes this week and see if they hit 107*F. If they do any birds nesting
there will lose their eggs or young! KK
Subj: Paint/Vanished eggs & chicks
Date: 6/21/99 9:26:09 AM Central Daylight Time
From: blueburd"at"srnet.com (Bruce Burdett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: blueburd"at"srnet.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
-from Bruce Burdett, NH Bluebird Conspiracy, Sunapee NH
In my free BB information packet I specify pretty categorically that BB
houses should not be painted, and that linseed oil only should be used as a
preservative. Do you folks out there agree that I'm right about this? Should we
perhaps use a light-colored "earth-tone" paint when the houses become weathered
dark gray or even black, and absorb too much summer heat? How would you evaluate
the trade-off here? (I think I have plenty of built-in ventilation.)
Also... Will Bluebirds remove from their nests infertile, thin-shelled, or
broken eggs, or even dead chicks, or should I consider other suspects?
I'd appreciate knowing your opinions.
Subj: PAINT/NO-PAINT
Date: 6/24/99 8:44:32 PM Central Daylight Time
From: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com (dean sheldon)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Of the 170 (+-) boxes on our trails, 150 (+-) are on utility poles. After
about 1 full year in the field, the unpainted boxes of yellow poplar and cedar
have weathered to a point where, from a moving auto, they are almost invisible.
Given the predilection toward vandalism of many of today's young moderns, I find
this tendency toward invisibility almost essential for the survival of the
trail. Another important consideration has to do with NOT placing boxes on poles
at intersections where cars are required to come to a stop. That just represents
an open invitation toward box-bashing with an empty Old Milwaukee bottle. We
have 20 or so boxes field-mounted on T-posts and we don't paint those either. In
my judgement, painting represents just another step in the nest box fabricating
process. Dean Sheldon, Huron County, OH/ CNBN Advisory Board
Subj: Painting Nestboxes
Date: 6/25/99 5:06:06 PM Central Daylight Time
From: BluBrdBob"at"prodigy.net (Robert M. Niebuhr)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: BluBrdBob"at"prodigy.net
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird-L)
I have been staining my nestboxes with a latex stain for the last 9 years and
bluebirds do not hesitate to use them. At the moment I have bluebirds using 175
of 233 nestboxes which tells me it doesn't stop the birds. I build them out of
#2 pine because it's cheap. The reason I do is because if I don't the wood
absorbs the water and the country I put them out in is subject rapid temperature
fluctuation and high winds. If the boxes get wet, then freeze, it causes them to
split. The same thing happens if they get wet and 50-70 mile per hour winds hit
them. Stain is a much better water repellent than paint and I put 2 coats on the
outside using a color called Chestnut. It's a medium brown in color. It works
great and there no oil based chemicals in it which could hurt the birds.
Bob Niebuhr
Great Falls, MT
Subj: Re: paint schemes
Date: 7/6/99 7:53:38 AM Central Daylight Time
From: kridler"at"1Starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: kridler"at"1Starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Keith Kridler
As a guide to paint colors stop by your paint center and ask to see the LRV
chart for colors. This is "Light Reflective Value" all colors reflect a certain
amount of light and the balance is absorbed by the color (then the box heats
up). Light reflective value is the amount of light reflected.Sherwin Williams
has a list of all of their LRV values in the front of all bundled paint swatches
given to contractors. A quick glance through my chart shows ALL dark colors (red
green blue etc) in the single digits (this is bad since these dark colors absorb
over 90% of all heat striking the box!) Many off whites (very light blues reds
greens) will reach the 60-70% range and yellow whites will hit the upper 80%
reflective quality which we are seeking.
The more gloss value of paint the higher the years of warranty and the
cleaner it stays and the cooler it stays. (Flat exterior paint will often have
half the warranty of high gloss paint in the same line. Flat paint is designed
to have millions of tiny bubbles in the finished dry film and will look like a
sponge under high magnification. These holes trap mildew, dirt ETC and high
gloss should look like a sheet of glass under the microscope.)
Frank: Since many cavity nesters are about to die in the northeast heat wave
please share with this list the amount of heat rise you experienced! I posted
heat test results to the list from the late 60's and early 80's this spring but
many people don't worry about this since they didn't expect 105*f in New York. I
heard that the astro turf at the Cincinnati Reds game hit 153*F yesterday during
the game! In the old tests dark brown boxes gained 17*F over the air temperature
and white gained 5*F in NABS style boxes with no side roof overhang. EVERYONE in
the northeast needs to place a thermometer in an empty box and check it in the
middle of the day in full sun. Then think if you would place a child in a car in
full sun and subject them to these temperatures. Heat kills!
I have used all white PVC boxes for years and see no rejection by bluebirds
or other cavity nesters. I used to paint all birdhouse gourds white also. Vivian
M. Pitzrick gave the perfect answers to high heat just a couple of days ago to
this list. Prop up those tops and get PLENTY of air gap over the top of the
nest. If you only have a 3/4" hole on each side of your box you have .44 square
inches of ventilation per side! A 1/2" air gap 4" long is two square inches per
side! In our Texas heat (normally 100+*F) summers I can raise bluebirds in box
locations like Vivian mentions and I use boxes with 5.93 Square inches of
ventilation! And this is not counting the entrance holes!
Box temperature varies from different parts of the country, and is dependant
on elevation, amount of humidity in the air, air quality and sun angle. Test
your boxes! KK
Subj: Making
boxes..
Date: 11/28/99 4:24:29 PM Central Standard Time
From: eemmuu"at"att.net (carriers)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: eemmuu"at"att.net
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird talk)
Hello again Bluebirders,
It is that time of year again where we start building more boxes to replace the
old ones.I would like to through out a question here to help me with a choice.
For the past 7 years, I have been building and using the standard open front
boxes for my 200 plus BB box trail here in Harwinton CT. I am use to them; and
having tried several other designes throughout the years, I alway come back to
the standard front design. I use 6" & 4" rough cut, 1"thick local pine I get
inexpensivly from a local saw mill. I build them with 1-5/8" screws, and calk
all the surfaces to repel water and cold, which is nezzzsary here in New
England. I began painting all the cut edges and tops several years ago,and I
belive it makes the boxes last a bit longer.
My question:- Though these boxes have served me well, I still would like to
improve on their longevity, for some last for 3-4-5 or more years, but others
only a couple due to the nature of rough cut lumber. I do not treat the
exterior, and time, though making them look good, often causes cracks, joint
warping and breakdown of parts, which need constant replacement and repairing.
In the past two years, I have been given pine end cuts from a developer who
builds horse barns free of charge. From these, I build the same style box, but
fitting tighter together,having been plained, I use nails and glue instead of
screws. I then use water base paint mixed light gray on all exterior surfaces,
and add black brush strokes for a natural grain look. These boxes camaphlage
well (cut down on vandilism) and I hope will weather better than the non-painted
kind.
Rough cut lumber boxes sure look nice for several years or so, but in the long
run, I can build these new boxes cheaper, and protect the exterior from weather
and warpage better with my new found style of box.
Has anyone out there experienced this same lesson? and if so, I would be pleased
to hear about it. I'm sure others would as well....Thanks...Paul from
CT
Subj: Planed lumber
Date: 11/28/99 6:05:43 PM Central Standard Time
From: vivianmp"at"eznet.net (Vivian M. Pitzrick)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: vivianmp"at"eznet.net
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Vivian Pitzrick, Belmont, N.Y., Allegany County
Paul
Your boxes sound really great from the planed lumber. You are SO lucky (if you
believe in luck) to have such a good source of material.
Be sure to roughen, or cut small lines, below the entrance on the inside so
young birds will have a toe hole for exiting. Also, adult Tree Swallows are
sometimes trapped inside boxes of smooth lumber.
This bird line is the greatest....
Vivian
Subj: Box
Construction
Date: 11/28/99 9:41:04 PM Central Standard Time
From: Sialiaman"at"aol.com
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: Sialiaman"at"aol.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Richard Purvis, Anaheim CA
I have found that unpainted boxes crack and curl rapidly because of the weather
and sun. Nestbox life is really shortened so I paint mine heavily with an oil
based paint. I have found that water based paint does very little to protect the
wood. I paint them a light blue gray color which matches the sky and serves to
really camoflage them well.
Subj: nestboxes
Date: 11/29/99 7:31:05 AM Central Standard Time
From: kridler"at"1starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: kridler"at"1starnet.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas Still summer with flocks of geese heading
south! Soil temperature 67*F.
Rough cut lumber will absorb and give off slightly more moisture due to the
surface finish. The main culprit is the grain of the wood or the growth rings.
New hybrid pine trees are selected to grow over an inch a year. Thus you have a
only two years of "hard" winter rings in a flat cut 1X board. You probably can
select the lumber at these saw mills and look for a tree that grew in dense
shade or had bad growing conditions so that these growth rings are under 1/4"
apart. The smaller the better! It is these tight growth rings which will help
hold the board flat just like the multi layers of plywood in a sheet. Any less
than 5 plys in plywood will tend to warp badly when wet and dried.
This will ruffle some feathers but the best way to preserve a nestbox is to
immerse it in a bucket or tub of stain/thinned oil based paint thus letting it
soak up and seal the natural pipe lines in the wood which carried food from the
roots to the leaves in the tree and vice versa. It takes about 10 minutes a box
(just about the length of time to screw another one together) to soak the nest
box. Modern paints and stains can be bought which are safe for children's
furniture. (can be eaten with no ill effects)
Latex paints are designed for "one coat" coverage now days and should not be
used over new wood. Always use a primer which will penetrate the wood and then
top coat with latex. Again be sure to soak the cut ends of the wood. KK
Subj: Re: [Making boxes..]
Date: 11/29/99 7:31:06 AM Central Standard Time
From: stillwaterbirder"at"netscape.net (stuart roth)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: stillwaterbirder"at"netscape.net
To: eemmuu"at"att.net, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird talk)
carriers
wrote:
Hello again Bluebirders,
It is that time of year again where we start building more boxes to replace the
old ones.I would like to through out a question here to help me with a choice.
For the past 7 years, I have been building and using the standard open front
boxes for my 200 plus BB box trail here in Harwinton CT. I am use to them; and
having tried several other designes throughout the years, I alway come back to
the standard front design. I use 6" & 4" rough cut, 1"thick local pine I get
inexpensivly from a local saw mill. I build them with 1-5/8" screws, and calk
all the surfaces to repel water and cold, which is nezzzsary here in New
England. I began painting all the cut edges and tops several years ago,and I
belive it makes the boxes last a bit longer.
My question:- Though these boxes have served me well, I still would like to
improve on their longevity, for some last for 3-4-5 or more years, but others
only a couple due to the nature of rough cut lumber. I do not treat the
exterior, and time, though making them look good, often causes cracks, joint
warping and breakdown of parts, which need constant replacement and repairing.
In the past two years, I have been given pine end cuts from a developer who
builds horse barns free of charge. From these, I build the same style box, but
fitting tighter together,having been plained, I use nails and glue instead of
screws. I then use water base paint mixed light gray on all exterior surfaces,
and add black brush strokes for a natural grain look. These boxes camaphlage
well (cut down on vandilism) and I hope will weather better than the non-painted
kind.
Rough cut lumber boxes sure look nice for several years or so, but in the long
run, I can build these new boxes cheaper, and protect the exterior from weather
and warpage better with my new found style of box. Has anyone out there
experienced this same lesson? and if so, I would be pleased to hear about it.
I'm sure others would as well....Thanks...Paul from CT
Hi Paul
Two suggestions. One- use cedar, it will last much longer. two- instead of nails
or screws, use biscuits to join your wood pieces. all mine are done that why and
have had no problems at all. Happy birding, Stu
************************************************
Stu Roth
Stillwater Birder Co.
Clear View Bird House - A view inside nature
888-668-2627
http://www.stillwaterbirder.com
mailto:stu"at"stillwaterbirder.com
************************************************
Subj: Re: Box Construction
Date: 11/29/99 7:47:12 AM Central Standard Time
From: bakerbon"at"sni.net (Bonnie & Ed)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: bakerbon"at"sni.net
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Bonnie Boex, Dillon, CO
Rich: Painting nestboxes with oilbased paint raises a red flag at least for me.
Although our weather can be harsh and is persistently dry I still don't paint;
it seals the pores in the wood thereby cooking the nestlings in the summer when
its important that the wood 'breath.'
It may be a pain in the butt, but I use linseed oil at the end of each season to
get them thru the winter.
That's my 2 cents worth; now I'm braced to get blasted!!
...
Subj: FISH'S EVERLASTING
Date: 11/29/99 8:55:08 AM Central Standard Time
From: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com (dean sheldon)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
As usual, KK has it exactly right. I don't use any finish at all, but if I did,
I'd do it HIS way and HIS way only. Stain is to be much-preferred over
painting....and mineral spirits mixed with RAW linseed oil and oil based
paint....all in equal parts....will get the job done beautifully...and it lasts
forever. DO NOT USE BOILED LINSEED OIL !!!!We call it FISH'S EVERLASTING in
honor of the guy who introduced me to it years ago. Dean Sheldon, Huron County,
OH/NABS Board
...
Subj: Linseed.
Date: 11/29/99 9:49:58 AM Central Standard Time
From: blueburd"at"srnet.com (Bruce Burdett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: blueburd"at"srnet.com
To: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com (Dean Sheldon)
CC: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Dean (and anyone else),
This morning I see that you are inveighing against boiled linseed oil as a box
preservative. I would never be so imprudent, or so uncivil, or so presumptuous,
as to question anything you say. For me, your words are as Holy Writ. But though
I am admittedly naive, I am nonetheless a curious person. What properties does
boiled linseed oil have which make it unacceptable? Is RAW linseed oil better?
Worse? Just as bad? I usually put nothing whatever on my boxes, but when I do
think to apply something I pick up a linseed oil container without even noticing
whether it's 'boiled' or 'raw'. As George Costanza once asked, "Is this WRONG?"
My knowledge of basic chemistry is practically nil, obviously, and I'd
appreciate any enlightenment that you (or any lister) might be able to provide.
What, for example, does linseed oil, boiled or raw, have to do with fish? We're
all glad to see you're back from the infirmary, Dean, and inveighing against
this and that. It's like old times.
Bruce Burdett, NH Bluebird Conspiracy, Sunapee NH
Subj: Re: FISH'S EVERLASTING
Date: 11/29/99 7:27:04 PM Central Standard Time
From: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com (dean sheldon)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com
To: bakerbon"at"sni.net
CC: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
OK: By itself, either raw or boiled linseed oil will work on unfinished
wood....BUT if you use Fish's Everlasting mixture of equal parts of oil-based
EXTERIOR paint, mineral spirits and linseed oil...you MUST use RAW linseed oil
in the mixture. If you use boiled linseed oil, the oil-based paint in the
mixture will never dry. And this comes not only from Jim Fish himself, but also
from Paul Ludwig, manager of the Paint Department at the world-famous Home
Hardware in Ashland, OH. A full field testing of the mixture has been done many
times here on lots and lots of boxes....with great results. Dean
...
Subj: Re: Box Construction
Date: 11/29/99 8:11:50 PM Central Standard Time
From: lviolett"at"earthlink.net (Linda Violett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: lviolett"at"earthlink.net
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu)
Linda Violett - Yorba Linda, Calif.
Bonnie, can you explain, exactly, how paint on the exterior of a nestbox cooks
your nestlings? Does the concept also apply to PVC? And stain/oil-soaked wood
which seals wood pores? My boxes are completely sealed in clear silicone
caulking. Are my birds in danger? Thanks in advance.
...
Subj: styrofoam/Thompson's water seal
Date: 11/30/99 6:54:22 AM Central Standard Time
From: kridler"at"1starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: kridler"at"1starnet.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
Styrofoam was discussed a few month's back. It will work inside the box to even
out the heat/cold but remember that birds lose very little heat through their
bodies so in effect they use the boxes mainly for a windbreak & to stay away
from predators during the winter. In my area, mice, flying squirrels and
woodpeckers tend to chew Styrofoam and make a nest out of it. If you made
nestboxes sized for different woodpeckers and filled the box solid with 1" thick
sheets of the foam, when the 'pecker was done nesting in the foam it would make
a great show and tell nest cavity to take to schools or groups!
Thompson's water seal works great to dip /soak the cut ends of wood in. Stand
the cut pieces in a tray holding about 1/2" deep amount of the sealer for about
10 minutes. This does act as a solvent and plywood left in over night will
de-laminate as the glue is dissolved. I do not use any paint or stain on my
boxes & anyone using these paints/stains needs to treat them early enough to let
all of the fumes get out of the boxes so get busy now! I have boxes made from
several different bluebirders treated like I have suggested and have had their
boxes up for over 15 years and they are still in perfect condition.
Take a nestbox to your local paint store and give to the manager. Ask them to
"donate" miss matched exterior paints/stains to your bluebird trail nestbox
project. It is against federal laws to dump any liquid paint into any
landfill!!! Paint must be poured out on cardboard or something similar and
allowed to dry completely and then it can be discarded. Small stores tend to
break this little known law. KK
Subj: Chemical
INSIDE?!
Date: 12/1/99 9:44:08 AM Central Standard Time
From: blueburd"at"srnet.com (Bruce Burdett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: blueburd"at"srnet.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
At risk of sounding curmudgeonly, or whatever, I'd be a little leery about
putting chemical wood-preservative INSIDE my boxes, no matter WHAT it was, -
Thompson's, Cuprinol, Linseed Oil,...you name it. On the outside I'd be much
less leery, as long as the stuff was given plenty of time to dry, and to
dissipate whatever fumes were present. Confining and concentrating all those
dissipated fumes INSIDE the box makes me at least somewhat skeptical.
Bruce Burdett, NH
Bluebird Conspiracy, Sunapee NH, where it was +14 degrees this morning, our
coldest yet here so far. Over in Saranac Lake NY it was MINUS 4 degrees, which
surprises me, because these sizeable lakes, like Sunapee and Saranac, usually
store up enough summer heat to moderate the immediate vicinity during the fall
and early winter. Then in the spring the cold lakes keep their surroundings cold
for a while.
Subj: waterseal
Date: 12/1/99 8:44:53 AM Central Standard Time
From: dputman"at"syix.com (dputman)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dputman"at"syix.com
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu (bluebird)
Kevin Putman, Yuba City, CA
I've been using Thompson's waterseal on all of my nestboxes--bluebird, wood
duck, kestrel, barn-owl--for several years. I buy it in the 5 gal. size and use
a pump-up sprayer to apply it to dozens of boxes at once, all sitting side by
side--mass production. Thompsons is great at sheding water, that's for sure. I'm
not sure how long one application will last on a given box, but I've got some
3-yr old boxes that I know are still sheding water. There may be some hazard
from fumes if the boxes aren't allowed to dry out sufficiently before being put
to use. I don't know how this stacks up against some of the other methods,
price-wise; Thompson's is rather expensive, but it is worth investing in water
protection for the nestboxes, and it keeps the birds dryer, too.
Subj: Re: sealant
Date: 12/1/99 11:05:04 AM Central Standard Time
From: Tsapling"at"aol.com
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: Tsapling"at"aol.com
To: dmccue"at"usit.net, Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
Regarding your e-mail regarding the safety of sealants: gourds are incredibly
toxic, which is why humans when working on them ( ie opening them up) have to
wear gloves and face masks. There are plenty of books and net sites and clubs
regarding gourds.. Since they are converted from something toxic to something
humans have used over the centuries in which to store liquid and out of which to
drink I would think that they have learned about the safety of sealants. Some
websites/ e-mail addresses- (I don't know whether they will have answers):
California Chapter of the American Gourd Society
http://www//calgourd.com
leader/ writer in gourd making: Ginger Summit
gsummit"at"earthlink.net
President of the California Chapter of the American Gourd Society:
crookstool"at"aol.com name: Carol
Rookstool
editor of The Gourd, Journal of the American Gourd Society,
judyf"at"bpsinet.com
Judy Fornshell
American Gourd Society http:www.gourdcentral.com.ags.html
Tina
Subj: Boxes
Date: 12/1/99 5:12:53 PM Central Standard Time
From: eemmuu"at"att.net (carriers)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: eemmuu"at"att.net
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird talk)
Hello all, Paul from CT. I see cold has hit some of you in the south. It was 16f
here this morning! I'll trade that with you texas,at 28 anyday! Just keep the
fire burning! It's so good to read all the great replys here on the site. One
can lern a lot from all of you so quickly. Thanks all for sharing.!
I did look into lindseed oils, and the guy said the "Boiled" had a dryer in it,
and thats the one to use. Yes? Also to the barn theory of lasting so long...The
barn has long lengths of wood(boards), and thus less chance of warping and
cracking. Our boxes, being of short cuts, are much more susept to warping, do
you all agree?
I have some raw wooden bird boxes in my yard that are 10 + years old too, but
they spend more time in the shade, thus have less heat to warp them, unlike BB
boxes.....Any feedback to this idea?..Paul from Ct
Subj: Re: Box
Construction
Date: 12/1/99 7:30:34 PM Central Standard Time
From: birdsfly"at"innercite.com (Hatch Graham)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: birdsfly"at"innercite.com
To: bakerbon"at"sni.net
CC: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Okay. Here's the first blast. I respectfully suggest that 3/4" wood will NOT
breath. It will instead insulate against heat. Of course, you will need to have
lots of vents. Check with Keith Kridler for the amount of ventilation you need
in hot country. Don't expect any breathing from a wooden box.
Hatch
...
--
Hatch Graham, Editor, Bluebirds Fly! California Bluebird
Recovery Program
El Dorado County "at" 3100 ft, Lat 38°37'43"N, Long 120°37'47"W
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
for the encouragement and conservation of cavity nesters
-especially bluebirds- anywhere in the West
Subj: Re: Box
Construction
Date: 12/1/99 11:24:02 PM Central Standard Time
From: springer"at"alltel.net (Gary Springer)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: springer"at"alltel.net
To: birdsfly"at"innercite.com
CC: springer"at"alltel.net (Gary Springer), BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
(BLUEBIRD-L)
Dear Hatch,
Good to see your name come across my screen.
I believe you are right that the insulation factor of a nest box has little or
nothing to do with the wood 'breathing'. Accordingly, I do not believe a thin
coating of a sealant or other finish on the surface of the nest box will reduce
the insulation factor.
I do not use any type of coatings on my nest boxes but the many good posts of
late have me thinking about doing so. Had it not been for the fact that every
nest box I ever set out lasted more than eight years and very closely matches
the wood barn siding in durability, I would already be using a sealant.
However, the air pockets in the wood do have a lot to do with insulation. And,
if the finish absorbs into the wood, some of these air pockets will become
filled and the wood will offer less protection against the hot rays of the sun
and the cold spring nights. As with so many things, a little will probably go a
long way while a lot will probably be counter productive.
Also, I wonder. Certainly some water will eventually seep through whatever
finish is applied to the wood. And it seems that this water would have a much
more difficult time escaping the wood when warm dry weather returns than had no
finish at all been applied. Is it possible then that if a finish is used it is
necessary to continue applying new coats, whereas, if no finish is used from the
beginning, the nest box will have a sufficiently long life without repeated
coatings because it dries so much more readily.
In my experience, trying to keep something dry by covering it with a tarp,
blanket, plastic or any other type of covering only makes it stay wet long after
everything else has already dried.
Gary Springer
...
Subj: Re: Box Sealants
Date: 12/1/99 11:58:01 PM Central Standard Time
From: lviolett"at"earthlink.net (Linda Violett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: lviolett"at"earthlink.net
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu)
Linda Violett - Yorba Linda, Calif.
Gary and all, if the box is smear/brushed with clear silicone caulking, no water
gets into the box unless the box itself is heavily damaged. If any moisture were
to enter the box (wet birds entering the box), it would dissipate as usual
because of the unfinished interior.
When I inherited my trail during the fall of 1997, it had been finished with
water-based paint. The poorly-protected wood soaked up water during the
winterrains. Each box was sealed with oil-based paint before the nesting season
and I've never had a wet nest. My trail was completely made new this year with
2-holed boxes so I smear/brushed clear silicone caulking on all the new raw-wood
boxes. They look natural but they are completely waterproofed.
...
Subj: Re: Boxes and Paint
Date: 12/2/99 5:20:44 AM Central Standard Time
From: nestbox"at"1starnet.com (Kathleen Oschwald)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: nestbox"at"1starnet.com
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
One of the main reasons paint is used is to protect articles from UV radiation
which breaks down wood as well as causing problems for human skin, etc. The top
quality paints have more expensive pigments that scatter the light rather than
allow it to get to the material underneath. The other element to protect against
is water. Your houses in the shade have been protected from some of the UV
radiation, but even there a coating of some kind of paint would prevent the
deterioration caused by the many freeze-dry cycles where water gets into the
wood, freezes and expands and eventually cracks the wood and breaks it down. A
good acrylic latex over a primer will last a long time, and do a good job of
protecting the wood. However, if your boxes hold up for 10+ years, they are
doing just fine.
The drier in boiled linseed oil speeds up the oxidation, which slowly converts
the liquid to a solid (cross-linked) state. Without the drier the process is
very slow. For example, an oil painting isn't considered "dry" for at least 6
months.
Enough paint chemistry. Happy bluebirding!
Kate Oschwald
Sumner, TX
...
Subj: Re: Box Construction
Date: 12/4/99 5:55:38 PM Central Standard Time
From: springer"at"alltel.net (Gary Springer)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: springer"at"alltel.net
To: eemmuu"at"att.net
CC: springer"at"alltel.net (Gary Springer), BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
(BLUEBIRD-L)
Dear Paul,
I am perplexed that you and a couple others have had such bad luck with rough,
unplaned pine for nest box construction.
With the exception of two roofs, both of which lasted 8 years, I have never had
to make repairs to any of the nest boxes I've built using rough pine. I never
use finishes and I rarely use cauking. Many are made of wood I found in dumps
and nearly rotten before I built the box. Others were made when the lumber was
so green that sap sprayed me in the face when I ran it through the table saw.
I started to think that maybe it was because screws weren't being used. But you
said you did use screws. I just have to ask, what type and length of screws do
you use? Do you drill pilot holes before turning in the screws?
How can any of the parts warp when they are screwed together in the shape of a
box? I just can't picture it.
When you build a nest box do you keep the grain vertical on the front, back and
side panels or do you run the grain horizontal or mix match the grain?
Cracks would appear if the wood shrank after construction. Wood shrinks the most
during the curing process. If I used sap dripping, slimy, green lumber and put
nest boxes together and no significant stress cracks ever appeared even after
sitting in the hot Georgia sun in 110 degree temperatures, how is it possible to
use cured lumber and have them appear?
Keith Kridler commented that the annual rings in much of the planted pine are
very far apart. I've seen lumber where these rings are more than half an inch
apart. I'd never consider using wood like that. Its almost like balsa wood. I
went to pick up a shipment of lumber and it was like that. The boards were
nearly as limber as noodles. I didn't bother arguing with the saw mill. I just
took it down to the country general store and asked if anyone wanted a load of
lumber and accepted the first offer. Is this the type of wood you've had the bad
luck with?
As for the climate, I've had the same positive experiences in Pittsburgh as I've
had in Georgia. And, the nest boxes in the shade even seem to be holding up as
well as those in the sun.
Do you have any clues as to why we are having such vastly different experiences?
Gary Springer
...
Subj: waterseal
Date: 12/4/99 11:40:59 PM Central Standard Time
From: KCBSP"at"aol.com
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: KCBSP"at"aol.com
To: dputman"at"syix.com
CC: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Thompsons is great at sheding water, that's for sure. I'm not sure how long one
application will last on a given box, but I've got some 3-yr old boxes that I
know are still sheding water.
Kathy Clark New Cumberland, PA
I never used Thompson's..but I do use CWF UV on my log home. It also protects
against sunlight damage. Don't know if Thompson's does.
Subj: Re: Box Construction
Date: 12/5/99 7:03:35 AM Central Standard Time
From: dmccue"at"usit.net (Dan McCue)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dmccue"at"usit.net
To: springer"at"alltel.net
CC: eemmuu"at"att.net, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Gary and all - Most of you have your own ideas about construction and placement
and most are OK. I will try to be brief and tell how I make and place my boxes
here in West Tennessee. They are made of rough sawn western red cedar and no
treatment or paint. They are screwed together after a pilot hole is drilled with
a built in countersink so the 1 1/2 inch drywall screw can be flush with the
surface and not split the cedar. (dried cedar, logs on ground at least 1 year.)
The placement is
southeast in most cases at least 100 feet from other houses on wooden electric
poles (permission granted by the electric company) placed with hole at a 6 foot
person's eye level. Away from large trees where the grass is kept clipped
occassionally. I have at this writing about 125 boxes that I monitor each week
or two in the nesting season and have about 3 roosting boxes up in residentual
areas. My occupancy rate last year was 89 percent with bluebirds or at least one
successful nest. Very little evidence of predator problems. 2 titmouse nests, 3
with sparrow nests(which were immediately destroyed) and wasps claimed 3 or 4
boxes as I now remember, without checking my record book.
Those are my experience with boxes and placements, many boxes have been up 4 or
5 years with no replacement parts or deteriorization. Look just like when I
placed them except the fading of the pretty cedar when the sun weathers it. Just
bought, yesterday, another 150 dollars worth of lumber from the mill and have
about 85 orders for boxes that I must get busy on cutting and assembling.
Hope this has been
some help to some of you newer members. Good to hear from you, Gary, Joe, Bill
and so many others. Dan Mc Cue from Camden, TN, 70 miles due west of Nashville
on the beautiful TN River. Happy bluebirding all with the best in season's
greetings.
...
Subj: RE: waterseal
Date: 12/6/99 10:27:33 AM Central Standard Time
From: mcwrigh"at"nppd.com (Wright, Merlin C.)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: mcwrigh"at"nppd.com
To: KCBSP"at"aol.com ('KCBSP"at"aol.com'), dputman"at"syix.com
CC: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Before you buy some Thompson's waterseal you owe it to yourself to ask a
professional builder. I attended a workshop on deck building and was told that a
better material for protecting wood is half turpentine and half linseed oil. I
have some 10 year old boxes made of old barn boards and I have never treated the
wood.
...
Subj: Silicone
Caulking
Date: 1/22/00 11:50:36 AM Central Standard Time
From: lviolett"at"earthlink.net (Linda Violett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: lviolett"at"earthlink.net
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu)
Linda Violett - Yorba Linda, Calif.
I'd like to see some discussion of why linseed oils, etc. are being recommended
on this List hands-down over clear silicone caulking. Am I missing something?
The clear rubbery
silicone caulk has no toxic fumes or residue chemicals that are hotly debated on
this List. After the caulk has dried, your box looks natural, fills in all
cracks and seams in one application. The caulk expands and contracts with
changing weather conditions so it doesn't crack, doesn't need to be reapplied,
and keeps boxes completely waterproof.
Anyone interested might want to buy the cheaper "Alex" brand which seems to work
better on nestboxes than the gluey "GE" brand. Squirt it all over the outside of
the box/roof/seams. Smear it around in a continuous layer. The caulking is white
until it is completely dry in couple of days. The inside of the box, of course
is left unfinished unless you want to add silicone "ladders." Any moisture that
gets carried into the box by wet birds will dry out in this unfinished interior
just as it will in any other box.
Welcome to the List!
"F. Emad" wrote:
...
Subj: Re: Silicone Caulking
Date: 1/22/00 12:09:59 PM Central Standard Time
From: PapagenoNY"at"aol.com
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: PapagenoNY"at"aol.com
To: lviolett"at"earthlink.net, Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
Linda
OK- I'll start and add my two cents:
Given the two choices as equals, applying linseed oil with a paint brush is much
easier than "smearing" caulking all over the outside of the box. Besides, since
my boxes are assembled with screws, I don't have cracks to fill, for which
caulking would be the best choice. So, if linseed oil is "OK", then based on the
above comments, that's the direction I would go. If there is a downside, as the
earlier question posed, please advise.
Jerry Guilderland, NY
...
From the Desk of G.
HOUSER
PapagenoNY"at"aol.com
Specializing in "Quality" Spam
visit Curly at: Curlicue's
Home Page
End of Message
Have a GREAT Day!
Subj: Re: Silicone Caulking
Date: 1/22/00 5:50:26 PM Central Standard Time
From: lviolett"at"earthlink.net (Linda Violett)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: lviolett"at"earthlink.net
To: Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu (Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu)
Linda Violett - Yorba Linda, Calif.
Jerry, appreciated comments. I agree that applying silicone caulking all over
nestboxes is gluey and rather slow-go with a brush. I'm always looking for
easier ways to do things, so I now squirt the silicone on the box and smear it
around with my bare hand (a lot quicker than using a brush). For cleanup, all
you do is take a paper towel and wipe your hand. Any remainder comes off by
rubbing your hands together over a wastebasket for a few seconds, then wash your
hands as normal. No solvents to use and easier on the environment. Those who
want to test the effectiveness of silicone might want to smear it on a couple of
nestbox roofs.
...
Subj: Re: Silicone Caulking
Date: 1/22/00 6:03:36 PM Central Standard Time
From: sandy_flowers"at"yahoo.com (Sandy Pasquariello)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: sandy_flowers"at"yahoo.com
To: lviolett"at"earthlink.net, Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
(Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu)
Linda, I have refinished several pieces of furniture and have used tung oil on
some of them. It is a natural looking finish which is water proof and safe.
There is no odor and the grain of the wood shows through. You just apply it with
a cloth. This is a very easy finish to use on wood of all kinds. Sandy, Myrtle
Beach, S.C.
Subj: linseed oil,
nest box distances & droll yankees
Date: 1/24/00 11:31:43 PM Central Standard Time
From: Mstarrw"at"aol.com
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: Mstarrw"at"aol.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu, kridler"at"starnet.com
1-a) linseed oil: is boiled o.k.(available at Home Depot) or must it be "raw"?
1-b) do I mix equal parts oil and paint thinner? (pardon my ignorance, but is
thinner the same as turpentine?) (I want to also try Linda's recommendation of
silicone caulk)
2) what is the preferred distance between nextboxes (or a nest box and a garage
rafter, in my case): 100' or 300' or some other distance?
3) I thought BBs didn't eat seeds, so what's the deal with the Droll Yankees
dome BB feeder (seed saver)? I must be missing something. . .
You all are great!
Myrna Wosk (mstarrw"at"aol.com)
Subj: Re: linseed
oil, nest box distances & droll yankees
Date: 1/25/00 8:13:38 AM Central Standard Time
From: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com (dean sheldon)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com
To: Mstarrw"at"aol.com
CC: dsillick"at"iwaynet.net, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
As to #1: Fish's 'Everlasting' stain is composed of equal parts of [i.e. 1/3
each] of the following ingredients: oil base exterior paint (any color...it
should be light, but not white); mineral spirits (paint thinner) but NOT
turpentine; RAW (not boiled) linseed oil. Boiled linseed oil does not draw the
paint into the pores of the wood and it causes the paint not to dry. Mix all
ingredients together and apply as any stain. I've used quantities of it on
countless numbers of EABL nest boxes. 2] I believe that 100 YARDS is the
commonly accepted distance between boxes; 3] contact Darlene Sillick who knows
about the Droll Yankees feeder application for EABL. Dean Sheldon, Huron County,
OH/NABS Board
...
Subj: Re: linseed oil, nest box distances & droll yankees
Date: 1/25/00 8:20:06 AM Central Standard Time
From: hubertrap"at"webtv.net (Joe Huber)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: hubertrap"at"webtv.net
To: Mstarrw"at"aol.com, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Hello Myrna, Someone else will have to tell you about treating your boxes. I've
always painted mine. Paint thinner & turpentine are not the same but are
generally used for the same purpose. The best distance from your garage is about
100 feet so they are far enough away of a place where predators can sneak up on
them. There are cases where bluebirds have nested in boxes hanging from eves of
a house right outside a window. I suggest you locate boxes no more than 300 feet
apart since they must be near you. Other desirable birds may also use boxes. You
could even consider pairing boxes by placing two at each location about 15 feet
apart. Yes Bluebirds sometimes eat a few seeds but I doubt if they receive any
nutritional value from them. In winter they survive mostly on wild berries. Best
ones are Holly, cedar, Hawthorn, Multiflora rose hips, and mistletoe. If they
happen to hang around your yard and you want to feed them try beef suet crumbs
or meal worms. Feeding them is generally not needed and may be difficult to get
them started. Joe Huber Venice Fl.
Charter member NABS, Charter member OBS, Life member OBS Joe Huber
hubertrap"at"webtv.net
http://community.webtv.net/hubertrap/HOUSESPARROWCONTROL
http://community.webtv.net/hubertrap/RoostingBluebirds
Subj: EXTERIOR COATING ON BOXES
Date: 1/27/00 6:24:20 AM Central Standard Time
From: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com (dean sheldon)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com
To: beav"at"writeme.com
CC: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu, bluebird11"at"juno.com
Sorry...I don't think that it IS superior to ANYTHING. I don't like paint.
Moisture gets under it and it peels and bubbles and cracks. The las thing I
would do would be to paint a box. Stain is the answer and this stain is as cheap
and long lasting as any on the market. Jim Fish stained his house with it 40
years ago and it still looks as good today as it looked then. Light green would
do it nicely. PS: I mostly don't put anything on the boxes which I use...only
because I prefer to let them weather and become almost invisible in the
landscape. I think that that reduces the chances of vandalism. If you asked me
what to do, I'd say "put them out with NOTHING on them and after they had
weathered nicely for a couple of years, bring them in and put a couple of coats
of Thompson's Waterseal or other clear waterproofing and put them back up with a
preserved, naturally weathered, finish." That's more than I wanted to say.
Thanks for asking. PS: Do you belong to the Indiana Bluebird Society? If not,
you might contact: Ann Auer
. Thanks
...
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 14:00:44 -0500
From: "Fawzi P. Emad"
To:
Cc:
Subject: Re: your question re linseed oil
I have heard from several people and read some about the subject. Here is a
summary of what I have learned:
1. If the exterior is a wood such as redwood or cedar, you need not apply a
finish (or at most the linseed oil/turpentine mix as described in 4. below).
2. If the exterior is spruce/pine/fir then the best way is to paint it twice
with an exterior paint, off white color towards green, brown, etc (but a light
color). You can buy paint like this by the gallon cheaply from Home Depot or
other stores where people made a mistake in color and are returning the paint.
3. Keep the inside of the nestbox, holes, and vents clear of any finish.
4. If you decide to use linseed/turpentine mix then make sure to use "raw"
linseed oil, available at most paint stores. Mix from one to two parts of raw
linseed oil with one part of turpentine. Apply on the outside surfaces only, let
dry for at least a week or two (outdoors, as it has a strong odor indoors).
5. The part of the nestbox needing protection the most is the roof and the
side(s) facing west. If you can, apply a sealant on these parts. You can also
have replacement parts ready to use when these parts crack. This is one good
reason to use stainless steel screws instead of nails. You can then unscrew and
replace the worn parts of a box.
I hope this is useful for you!
Fawzi Emad, Laytonsville, Maryland
...
Subj: RE: more
questions
Date: 12/30/99 7:30:02 AM Central Standard Time
From: kridler"at"1starnet.com (Keith & Sandy Kridler)
Sender: owner-BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Reply-to: kridler"at"1starnet.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu (BLUEBIRD-L)
Keith Kridler Mt. Pleasant, Texas
Yes the Hantavirus has been found in many different states with many different
species of mice/rats. The strain in the southwest is seemingly more deadly but
the virus comes from the droppings/urine and not just the dander. Lots of
information on the web and several hours can be spent in some sites. Time well
spent......
Linseed oil: Is a natural oil similar to other "vegetable" oils that simply is
soaked up by the wood and thus blocks the flow of water into the board.
Polyurethane is a plastic type of varnish that hardens and creates a "shell" to
coat and cover the wood. Once the board splits this shells breaks and then the
protection is lost. Polyurethane is better for interior uses where 6-8 coats
will protect floors like in roller skating rinks. Some thinners and varnishes
are NOT compatible! You can end up with 4 gallons of sealer that clabbers like
cottage cheese. I see nothing wrong with the mix IF your small test mix of these
ingredients shows they mix and do not separate. Put a table spoon of each in a
clear jar and shake and watch the results.
Stain: I would not use this unless you have very "white" wood you want to
slightly darken.
Damp wood/damp boxes: I use a latex exterior varnish "Zip Guard" on wet wood and
this soaks in and dries in an hour or so. It does not work over fresh oil stains
or where "silicone" sealers like Thompson's have been used.
A fabulous sunrise is burning across the sky! Hungry birds are dropping from the
trees to the empty feeders......Got to go....Happy New year to all... KK
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 02:47:06 EST
From: Firecoach"at"aol.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: birdhouses
I hope this is not a Duh! and when you read this, not roll your eyes and say
"what an idiot"!! But with my brand new birdhouses should I seal, paint or
varnish them? Or leave them as plain wood. I mean inside where the mommy and
babies will be. Please be gentle I am a newbie -- but learning quick!
Marla
firecoach"at"aol.com
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 06:45:32 -0500
From: "Brian Bannon" bjbannon"at"mnsi.net
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: colour
Brian Bannon, Kingsville, Ontario
How important is the colour of the boxes to Eastern Bluebirds? I've heard
they like light colours. We have inherited a new home, saw bluebirds around and
want to encourage them. The boxes I have now are faded red and green and need
painting.
Brian Bannon
bjbannon"at"mnsi.net
http://www.mnsi.net/~bjbannon/
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 06:06:16 -0600
From: "Wright, Merlin C." mcwrigh"at"nppd.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: RE: colour
Colour probably doesn't matter much BUT, it should be light so the heat from
the sun is reflected, light so the black entrance shows up and light so vandels
don't notice. Tan is a good choice. Most paint stores that mix will have some
cheap gallons that were mistakes and could be altered for you by them.
Merlin Wright at Brownville Nebraska
...
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:21:30 -0600
From: "Bill Darnell" bdarnell"at"centurytel.net
To: Firecoach"at"aol.com, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: birdhouses
Bill Darnell
Savannah, TN
Marla:
I have just recently began using Thompson's Water seal on the outside of
mine. I use a grayish shade, which is nearly the color they would age to. I do
it not for the color effect though, but because it might give me 3 or 4 more
seasons of use before I have to replace. It looks like a gallon may paint as
many as 50 - 70 boxes, cost about $12. Seems pretty cost-effective to me!
Bill
...
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 08:41:49 -0500
From: "Bruce Burdett" blueburd"at"srnet.com
To: bjbannon"at"mnsi.net
Cc: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: De que color?
To: Brian Bannon, et al
From: Bruce Burdett, Sunapee NH blueburd"at"srnet.com
Many bluebirders, - including this one, - do not paint their houses ANY
color. We simply let them weather naturally to a neutral grey. Some of my pine
houses have been up for 9 years, winter and summer, and are still as sound as
ever. If I remember to, I give the exteriors a good soaking with linseed oil,
but usually I forget, and it doesn't seem to make much difference.
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 09:28:29 -0500
From: Di & George dgslavin"at"accucom.net
To: "'Bluebird-L"at"Cornell.edu'" Bluebird-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: BB House color.
Hi, I think that these posts about birdhouse colors is an interesting thing
to think about. I let mine just age a natural color. But.. I was given one that
had been painted white.. every year there has been a chickadee in that box. I
don't know if it is just the location or the color of the box.. but now that I
think about it.. it would be interesting to learn what others have seen.
We know that location is important, size is important... maybe the color
thing is too? What does everyone think?? Is it important or not? Or just the way
it happenend?
Diane Slavin
Vernon, NY
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 11:20:37 -0600
From: "Fread Loane" firefrost2"at"earthlink.net
To: "BLUEBIRD-L" BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Nestbox Colors
My personal feelings about nestbox colors, in my particular area, is that
they should appear as natural as can be. This is as much a feeling for personal
aesthetics as it is for security from vandals. To me, the astounding aspect of
all of this, is that the birds even find the nestboxes! Think about how entirely
and infinitely they are aware of their surroundings to discover such a small
box!
Properly constructed and monitored, I am sure that there are individual boxes
that have accounted for amazing numbers of broods successfully fledged and never
received a coat of protective cover!
Fread J. Loane
Tulsa, Oklahoma
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 21:50:37 -0800
From: Maynard R Sumner m-r-sumner"at"juno.com
To: Firecoach"at"aol.com
Cc: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: birdhouses
Marla,
Leave plain wood inside. Sometimes we do the outside, but not the inside.
Maynard R Sumner
Flint, Michigan
Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.
On Fri, 25 Feb 2000 02:47:06 EST Firecoach"at"aol.com writes:
...
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 18:18:37 -0800
From: Hatch Graham
To: Fread Loane
Cc: BLUEBIRD-L
, Don Yoder
Subject: Re: Nestbox Colors (Add Attraction SPOTs
Hi All:
[2.5" of rain during the last 24]
My mentor, Don Yoder, early on, told me about "attraction spots." I've been
using and recommending them ever since. Don claims a great increase because of
them. I have no tests to prove it but it just makes sense. Perhaps Don will tell
us where the idea came from. On a new nestbox, with a black ink marker, draw a
black 1.5" circle on both sides of the nestbox to represent an entry hole. Gives
the bird three sides from which to see a possible cavity and investigate. When
they get to the box, the bogus holes are obvious but the will find the real one.
Hatch
...
--
Hatch Graham, Editor, Bluebirds Fly! California Bluebird
Recovery Program
El Dorado County "at" 3100 ft, Lat 38°37'43"N, Long 120°37'47"W
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
for the encouragement and conservation of cavity nesters
-especially bluebirds- anywhere in the West
Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 16:06:46 -0600
From: "PAMELA S SPARKS"
To:
,
Cc:
Subject: Re: De que color?
Brian,
My pine boxes left natural don't last as long as Bruce's. I'm happy if I get
five years before there is major deterioration.
I try to always use cedar, but if I have to use pine, I now paint or use a
pigmented stain.
Dan Sparks
Brown County Bluebird Society
Nashville, IN
"Bruce Burdett"
02/25 8:41 AM
To: Brian Bannon, et al
From: Bruce Burdett, Sunapee NH blueburd"at"srnet.com
Many bluebirders, - including this one, - do not paint their houses ANY color.
We simply let them weather naturally to a neutral grey. Some of my pine houses
have been up for 9 years, winter and summer, and are still as sound as ever. If
I remember to, I give the exteriors a good soaking with linseed oil, but usually
I forget, and it doesn't seem to make much difference.
Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 13:50:34 -0500
From: "Donald Morse Jr." morsedr"at"email.uc.edu
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu, NESTBOX-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Bluebird box questions
Donald Morse Jr., 66°F, New Richmond, OH., ~30 miles SE of Cincinnati, OH.
Some nesting material in bottom of my box. I am new to the list.
I have a question. Recently, I had volunteered to offer my
knowledge/assistance to the student government of my college, which is in the
process of building Bluebird boxes to distribute/sell at an upcoming event. They
had asked me what kind of paint they should use on the outside of the box. Since
I prefer not to paint my boxes, (cedar) I couldn't answer their question.
I told them that they should use a light color to avoid baking the birds.
They were also concerned about any negative effects the paint may have on the
birds. I do not know of any negative effects of paint on birds.
Any help would be appreciated! (sorry for any cross posting)
--
Donald Morse Jr.
student-Biology-University of Cincinnati/Clermont College
volunteer educator - Cincinnati Nature Center
New Richmond, OH. USA - Ohio Backyards Wildlife Site #626-Zone #6
mailto:morsedr"at"email.uc.edu mailto:dmorsejr"at"hotmail.com
http://oz.uc.edu:8000/~morsedr/natureHomepage.html
Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2000 08:43:53 -0600
From: Theresa Brandt Theresa"at"Bowecho.com
To: "BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu" BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: bird houses
have a beginner question.
I have put out two houses for bluebirds. They are raw, pine, and I did not
finish them. I wanted them to age. Is this acceptable? Do most people paint
their bluebird houses? I figured they would work for a few years, then I might
have to replace them, but painting them seeemed like a lot of work.
Thanks,
--
Theresa&theBowEchoGang
"at"Theresa"at"BowEcho.com
Hanging onto bitterness and resentment is like eating poison and expecting
somebody else to die.
-- Unknown
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 11:31:18 -0400
From: "Bruce Burdett" blueburd"at"srnet.com
To: Theresa"at"Bowecho.com, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: bird houses
Theresa, et al,
There is considerable debate about the question of painting or not painting.
I do not paint, and I recommend not painting in my free info packet. I've been
criticized for this stance, but always in a civil manner. I do, however, put a
heavy coat of linseed oil on the OUTSIDE of new boxes. Linseed is a natural
product, unlike most paints.
(I did paint a box white once, - my only Peterson box, - but I only use it
for show-and-tell at presentations: - "Now this- here is a Peterson box, etc.,
etc,")
I know, however, that a lot of folks DO paint their boxes, and think it works
fine. Most of these people use 'earth tones' of one kind or another, leaning to
LIGHT tones because light tones reflect the lethal heat of summer in warm
climates. Obviously, paint makes your boxes last longer. I must insert, however,
that I have some unpainted white pine boxes that have been up for 9 years,
year-round, and are still as good as new, structurally, though they've weathered
to an inconspicuous gray. (grey) I should add, too, that I've sometimes
FORGOTTEN to put on the linseed oil, and that it doesn't seem to make a whole
lot of difference. White pine is an astonishingly durable wood. The common
preservative turpentine is distilled from pine gums, after all.
...
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 12:22:03 EDT
From: Dinlows"at"aol.com
To: Theresa"at"bowecho.com, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: bird houses
Hi Theresa,
Love your poem!
You don't want to paint your houses. I like to put all my bird houses out to
"weather" and it does seem to make a difference. I have another wren house to
put up now so it can weather all winter. Does anyone else do this with their
boxes?
Linda - Ind.
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 12:37:46 -0400
From: "Fawzi P. Emad femad <at> fpemad <dot> com
To: Theresa"at"Bowecho.com
Cc: "bluebird-l" BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: bird houses
I love the quote at the end of your Message! As to houses, I do the same. I
make my own out of pine, and put them out. The BBs seem to like the older houses
more than the new ones... so I leave them out to age. Since I use SS screws, I
can replace any part of a house as needed, so I do not throw them away when they
get old, I just unscrew the bad part and replace it with a new part! Like you, I
do not like to paint and do not use finishing products... (such painting and
finishing would increase the life of the box, but I can always fix it instead).
Fawzi from MD
...
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 16:32:34 -0700
From: "judymellin" judymellin"at"netzero.net
To: blueburd"at"srnet.com, Theresa"at"Bowecho.com, BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Re: bird houses
This echoes Cornell's recommendation in the manual and my own experiences.
Cornell recommends no paint but, if one chooses to paint, the suggestion is
light colors and outside only. We have had boxes up since 1983 made of pine and
untreated that have weathered very well. The roofs are going so we are going to
replace with boxes that are screwed together so that we can replace parts rather
than the whole in the future. Sometimes, I think we paint or varnish for our own
esthetics because I truly don't think the blues can tell!
Judy Mellin
Palatine, IL. (where any house that stands through our winters is a winner!)
...
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 21:26:28 -0400
From: "Nancy Mills" nmills"at"stny.rr.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Weathered Houses
Hi All,
The first house I put out was a wren/chickadee house and had no takers the first
year. Left it out all winter in the same tree and sure enough this past spring I
had a pair of Chickadees that had 5 eggs but it failed. A house wren took it
over and had a successful nest and all 5 wren babies fledged.
Nancy
Nichols, NY
Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2000 07:47:28 EDT
From: "dean sheldon" dsheldonjr"at"hotmail.com
To: nmills"at"stny.rr.com
Cc: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: SILK PURSE/SOW'S EAR
Nancy: This is another one of those matters about which not everyone would
agree. There are some people who claim that EABL take more readily to new
boxes...made of fresh, clean wood. They believe that the birds search out those
boxes and that if you are having difficulty attracting birds, you should put out
a brand new box in that location. And then there are those who would tell you
that the birds prefer boxes that are "weathered" or "seasoned" by having been
mounted outdoors for a period of time before the season begins. I don't need to
make many new boxes from scratch anymore....I am too busy in the shop making
"silk purses" out of "sow's ears."....i.e. taking old, worn boxes apart and
replacing the bad parts with good pieces [especially roofs] and getting the
boxes ready to go back in the field. Sometimes, in the process, the boxes prove
to be irrepairable.....we cook out all summer over those that "don't make the
cut." My personal opinion is that EABL will nest in almost anything [no matter
how new or old] that is placed in "user friendly" habitat. We, as bluebirders,
spend entirely too much time putting nest boxes where WE want the birds to
be....rather than in locations which might be more suitable for the birds
themselves. But, no matter what, I always think it important to emulate the
natural cavities in which these birds have nested historically. That is why I do
not put any finish on the boxes and why I leave them on the trail until they are
no longer safe or weather-tight enough to suitably shelter the birds....they
look terrible....but the birds are drawn to them season after season. Dean
Sheldon, Huron County, OH [just south of Lake Erie]
From: "Nancy Mills" nmills"at"stny.rr.com
Reply-To: nmills"at"stny.rr.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Weathered Houses
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2000 21:26:28 -0400
...
Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 09:01:17 -0400
From: "Nancy Mills" nmills"at"stny.rr.com
To: BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Weathered or Not
Thank you Dean. I believe you are right as I also put up a new Bluebird box
on a pole system and it was no time at all and a Male House Sparrow was eyeing
it then a pair of Tree Swallows came into the picture and were able to chase the
House Sparrow off and claim the box for their own. Their first attempt failed as
all 6 eggs were gone, so I got a baffle and they nested again and this time
successfully fledged all 5 babies.
As you said and I agree that sometimes it doesn't matter if it's new or old
it depends on what kind of habitat it is put up in. My old box was left in a
small tree and the new box was on the other side of the yard and both were near
other bigger trees and a brush pile and both had takers.
Nancy
Nichols, NY
Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2000 10:32:22 -0700
From: "Nicholas A. Zbiciak" nzbiciak"at"gfn.org
To: "'Theresa"at"Bowecho.com'"
Theresa"at"Bowecho.com,"BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu"BLUEBIRD-L"at"cornell.edu
Subject: RE: bird houses
Hi Theresa.
Not necessary to paint them. You may experience some swelling of the wood
after a lot of rain. This will make the door hard to open--if it is a tight
fit--until the wood dries; This can be addressed by filing the door about 1/8
inch.
Cedar is a very good wood to use as it handles a lot of weather for a long
time. I think your pine should be fine for quite some time as well.
Welcome, and Happy Birding!
Nicholas
have a beginner question.
...
Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 12:41:39 EDT
From: RMoore1718"at"aol.com
To: Bluebird-l"at"cornell.edu
Subject: Waterproofing
Bob Moore
Gambrills, md
39.00.07n
76.39.10w
Hi
Does anyone have the name od a good sealer or other method of weaterproofing
bird boxes. Your assistance would be appreciated. Bob
Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 13:17:26 -0400
From: "Bruce Burdett"
To:
Subject: Proofing (water)
To Bob Moore, et al,
All I ever use for waterproofing on new houses is linseed oil on the outside,
(unless I forget to apply it) and a bead of caulking along the joint between the
top board and the back board. After that, once the house is weathered well, the
only thing I renew is the caulking, which usually lasts a few years.
Bruce Burdett, NH Bluebird Conspiracy, Sunapee NH
blueburd"at"srnet.com
Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 12:42:15 -0500
From: "Bill Darnell"
To:
,
Subject: Re: Waterproofing
Bob:
I used Thompson's water seal from Wal-Mart. In just one season, they look much
better than the unfinished ones. I used a gray shade. I will post the numbers so
it can easily be duplicated if I can think to look on the can! The top is not
cupped as bad, and there are far fewer checks vs. the unfinished. The birds seem
to like them fine. They wood is pine. I will finish all boxes with it this
winter.
Bill
TN
...
Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2000 11:59:45 -0600
From: "Robert Wilson"
To: "Bluebird List"
Subject: RE: Water proof
I would like to remind everyone that my Wilson PVC Boxes are waterproof. They
also don't rot, split, swell up, predators can't make the holes larger or get a
foot hold on the surface, may be cooler and they are essential FREE. I don't
sell these as I am much too busy to get into business.
Bob Wilson
(970) 242-5190
39* 06.21N 108*33.61 W
4,635 elevation Grand Junction Colorado
THE HOME OF ALL THREE BLUEBIRD SPECIES
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